My View on Arelith

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The GrumpyCat
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Re: My View on Arelith

Post by The GrumpyCat » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:53 pm

Bryce Silver-Wind wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:36 pm
Ork wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:25 pm
Well.. I mean at least
Bryce Silver-Wind wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:08 pm
Also either you take the slave collar, or I will just kill and corpse bash....was one I have heard before, and since no one wanted that....
I mean ..at least this one is IC. The other examples are horribly manipulative. I feel like the permanent collar needs to be locked behind a DM request & the prisoner's collar available always. If the system is abused to that extent, it's the only way to safeguard against misdeeds.
Fairly...if you have been OOCly manipulated into the collar, I have no doubts the DMs will remove the collar.
We'd look into the situation carefully first - but yes, this is basically true.

As for 'Death or Slavery', it really depends a little on how awear the person is of the slavery rules, and how it's phrased. Your attacker is not 'obliged' to offer you another way out. Sometimes you just have to lump the xp loss. It's a shame, but there it is.
This too shall pass.

(I now have a DM Discord (I hope) It's DM GrumpyCat#7185 but please keep in mind I'm very busy IRL so I can't promise how quick I'll get back to you.)

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Atlantahammy
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Re: My View on Arelith

Post by Atlantahammy » Wed Sep 19, 2018 2:20 am

DM GrumpyCat wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:53 pm
Bryce Silver-Wind wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:36 pm
Ork wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:25 pm
Well.. I mean at least

I mean ..at least this one is IC. The other examples are horribly manipulative. I feel like the permanent collar needs to be locked behind a DM request & the prisoner's collar available always. If the system is abused to that extent, it's the only way to safeguard against misdeeds.
Fairly...if you have been OOCly manipulated into the collar, I have no doubts the DMs will remove the collar.
We'd look into the situation carefully first - but yes, this is basically true.

As for 'Death or Slavery', it really depends a little on how awear the person is of the slavery rules, and how it's phrased. Your attacker is not 'obliged' to offer you another way out. Sometimes you just have to lump the xp loss. It's a shame, but there it is.
Another much more sneaky, and commonly used tacit, is not telling people that is a actual thing, so they feel they have to accept out of obligation, so more often then not it's new commoner that get tricked into such. (Which Is what I more often have to deal with)

They'll be told to talk to the slaver, and to accept, and pretty much nothing else.

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caldura firebourne
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Re: My View on Arelith

Post by caldura firebourne » Wed Sep 19, 2018 2:41 am

It's also possible that's what you're being told because in many circumstances a slave freeing player has refuse to help "willing" slaves in the past

Ultimately if you feel someone has been tricked or pushed against their will into enslaving their character, get a DM involved

Having played with slavers both as a slaver and a slave, I've never seen this issue, and in many cases I've been reminded OOC to make sure the soon to be slave knows OOC that they can in fact opt out

It's very frustrating as a slaver to have an unwilling player behind the slave, just as I'm sure it's frustrating to have a slave who's player is unwilling to accept help to freedom.
Plays as the monster in your closet

Nitro
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Re: My View on Arelith

Post by Nitro » Wed Sep 19, 2018 10:44 am

To reply to some of your points in no particular order.
Underdark/Overworld position and relations:
The Underdark used to be a lot harder to access back in the day, and some DM's were very harsh on people who came down there from above. As a result it was a ghost town. The oldschool crowd might not like the more skullport-esque setting of Andunor but I for one quite like that it brings such large groups of players into the underdark setting.
Player Housing, Locks and Factions:
It is possible to break in to player housing, but it takes a lot of dedication. Personally I think that's for he best otherwise low-STR characters get screwed on safe storage space. As for guild houses, there are quite a lot but they are very popular. If you believe a particular group of people are sharing a property back and forth between themselves feel free to report it to the DM's, it probably falls within the muling rules.
Dungoeneering:
I advise that you start exploring some of the lowerdark and other endgame dungeons, because some of those are truly long slogs of tedium. Abyssal wastes and lost desert will be right up your alley if you prefer walking around for a long time instead of being able to lense out on demand.
Loot and Gear:
We used to have a system for spawning 'artifacts' in some hard dungeons, only the problem was that the very best artifacts were hoarded up and never let go of. Even if you make them non-repairable that just means casters get a free pass to keep theirs forever while melee's have to keep a set of theirs to swap in/out for hard encounters/pvp. It also irrevocably messes with the server balance. If Jimmy-epic-man whose character has been around for 10 RL years and got a full set of legendary artifacts equipped on him that are completely out of reach for a new character, even established characters, isn't that a little unfair to everyone but the most hardcorest and oldschoolest crowd?
Racial Requirements, AA:
You said it yourself when you described dwarven defenders. An Arcane Archer isn't just some guy who can make magical arrows, it's the culmination of elven dexterity, archery and magical culture and craftsmanship come together to make the perfect archer. It fits right up the elven class fantasy of elves being the very best at archery.
UMD:
Had it been 15 years ago, removing UMD dumps might have worked, but if it was done today you'd have to essentially rework the entire server from ground up as everything is balanced around them. Casters would have to be further nerfed, mundanes buffed in other ways, all dungeons and mobs server-wide have to be rebalanced or outright overhauled. Heck, even some puzzles probably have to be changed. A lot of work in the name of 'balance' when things are at a fairly balanced state right now with UMD as the balancer.
Summons:
First off, Dragon Knight is one of the better epic spells. Drop one of these on a boss or in PvP and it'll clean house for you.

Secondly, if summons weren't strong enough to let a caster solo content like a melee can, then what? Force wizards and sorcs to attach to parties where they do nothing but buffing their party-members and sometimes once in a blue moon drop a missile storm?
Palemaster:
I actually agree completely here. Palemaster is one of my favourite classes and I really didn't like it when it was first reworked all those years ago. I still don't like the direction it's gone in even though it's far, far better mechanically than it was before. I know it's a lot of work, but if palemaster got back their old summons that scale up regularly as they level and had those changed to fit Arelith standards I'd be a happy camper because it'd put Palemasters back as the supreme undead summoners.

Brandon Steel
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Re: My View on Arelith

Post by Brandon Steel » Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:39 pm

Agreed about the UD anyways, it really doesn’t feel like the UD most of the time. I’d be lying if I didn’t dislike the huge amounts of outcasts that are really no different from most surfacers. Still think it should be switched to a reward now that the population isn’t near as bad as it was back in the day.

rookie
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Re: My View on Arelith

Post by rookie » Thu Sep 20, 2018 3:16 pm

I'm not up-to-date on the slave/prisoner collar mechanics, but I remember in the past wondering why it wasn't mechanically enforced on previously free PCs to be:

Free -> Prisoner Collar for x time period as a "trial" -> Slave Collar

Where x would be a couple of RL days. Basically gives everyone involved a bit of a grace period to see if the situation works. Might encourage more people to be willing to try it out if the opportunity came from an unplanned encounter.

Basementfellow
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Re: My View on Arelith

Post by Basementfellow » Thu Sep 20, 2018 6:27 pm

I never understood the Nerf UMD camp. Spellcasters are practically irreplaceable, but UMD allows mundanes to stand a chance without them. Wands and scrolls are just like any other consumable -- you trade coin for some temporary utility. Quite frankly, increasing the investment required to access this utility wouldn't change much. It'd only make the game more tedious.
Iceborn wrote:I shall very inefficiently murder with a spoon the next individual that mentions Shrek.

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msterswrdsmn
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Re: My View on Arelith

Post by msterswrdsmn » Thu Sep 20, 2018 6:34 pm

UMD seems fine to me, as far as i've seen. Yes, it lets you use wands/scrolls with a low dump-friendly investment of 15. Most of the UMD stuff that is actually useful and not complete garbage (I'm looking at you, dispel wand) are utility buffs; bulls STR wands for hauling gear, mage armor wands for cheap AC, etc. I honestly can say i've never encountered a timestop-spamming rogue or anyone spamming IGMS scrolls. Most offensive UMD items are tied to their innate level, which makes them awful (again, looking at you dispel wand).

And again, as pointed out; they're consumable. Its like crack; once someone gets a taste of wand-buffing, they're gonna keep coming back. Which means money for the dealer-mage. Which can be directly reinvested to upping the dealers gear/items/whatever you spend gold on. Its a win-win on both ends.

SERIOUS UMD investment...meh. As someone who is doing this right now? You need a LOT of UMD to use some of the better items. Some of the stuff has a DC of 70 which practically requires you to build around UMD (which i'm not doing), while some of the higher-end stuff in the middle is around 40 DC (which I am shooting for) that still requires a very large, end-game investment to make use of unless you're playing a CHA bard-based class or take some serious UMD boosting steps (burning gear slots and feats which can be put to better use, especially on bards that area already feat-starved)

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