"A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

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The Fairy Feller
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"A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by The Fairy Feller » Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:04 pm

A member of your party is 6 or more levels above the max level of one of your quest writs. You will make no progress on the quest "[Quest Name]".
Why was it recently level locked so that higher level people for specific writs can no longer help people finish their quests?

I am not entirely sure this was needed, mostly, because people will complete their writs eventually, but, now as someone who is higher level you can't really do this to help / or interact with people who are having trouble completing things. Mages, druids, clerics can still buff people... but mundanes can't even do anything at all now to help people they're associated with.

Now I get some folks might be using this to try and hyper twink their friends to the end game zones... but at the same time I don't really see how this hurts anyone or anything.

I feel this could maybe be reconsidered because all this does is stop people from being able to help new players as well as to further their guilds / factions / settlements.

PinataPlethora
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by PinataPlethora » Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:34 pm

Couldn't you just boot that member from the party and still have them tag along?

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The Fairy Feller
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by The Fairy Feller » Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:43 pm

You still can't help them succeed effectively. It becomes an act of tedium. If you intercede they don't get credit for their quest.

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Dean
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Dean » Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:53 pm

Yeah, I agree that it is a bit poor. Writs provided factions and groups an easy way to assist and associate with lower level members or just players in general. It allowed them to advance a bit without sitting down and hard grinding them to a higher level. A bit of gold, some adventure xp, and direct xp to also introduce them to the group or allow higher levels to chill with lower levels in a way other than just sitting around a table and talking. Provided both parties with something to do.

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Phoxly
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Phoxly » Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:58 pm

I would appreciate this more if there was actually a way to consistently find people to level with that are close to your level.

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HD52
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by HD52 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:06 pm

At the very least, I would like it if it didn't spam the message so much!
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Rwby
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Rwby » Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:08 pm

I agree with all of the above. I actually thought it was a really nice part of the writ system that you were able to accept you'd get next to nothing for spawns, but some XP for turning in the quest if you completed it with a friend/mentor/sponsor. If this is a case of a few individuals ruthlessly abusing the system, shouldn't those individuals be punished rather than a blanket ban like this?

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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by PinataPlethora » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:41 pm

Finally ran into this one, myself. I get the reason for it, but the constant messages are a real pain. I could do with those only popping up at transitions.

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Cortex
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Cortex » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:07 pm

That way you can never complain about not getting a warning!
:)

thingsicantdo
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by thingsicantdo » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:09 pm

i'm happy with any change that results in fewer high level characters in low level dungeons. :D

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susitsu
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by susitsu » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:32 pm

Yeah, this seems sudden and new...

I just spent hours making a ton of RP out of helping a few people do their writs. This is, wow.

PinataPlethora
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by PinataPlethora » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:46 pm

Cortex wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:07 pm
That way you can never complain about not getting a warning!
Cortex attacks The Forums: *hit*: (8 + 32 = 40)
Cortex damages The Forums: 11 (9 Physical 1 Salt)
[WARNING: Spellsword is an experimental class, subject to changes at any time. You may find that your class abilities have been altered or removed without warning.]
Cortex attacks The Forums: *miss*: (3 + 32 = 35)
[WARNING: Spellsword is an experimental class, subject to changes at any time. You may find that your class abilities have been altered or removed without warning.]
Cortex attacks The Forums: *hit*: (17 + 32 = 49)
Cortex damages The Forums: 14 (11 Physical 3 Salt)
[WARNING: Spellsword is an experimental class, subject to changes at any time. You may find that your class abilities have been altered or removed without warning.]
Cortex killed The Forums
[WARNING: Spellsword is an experimental class, subject to changes at any time. You may find that your class abilities have been altered or removed without warning.]

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Leshpar
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Leshpar » Thu Jun 14, 2018 12:20 am

This is the biggest *redacted* I have heard in a long while. Now we're punished for playing with friends if our level is different? Who cares?

yellowcateyes
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by yellowcateyes » Thu Jun 14, 2018 12:47 am

If anything, the level range supported by writs is too generous.

The frequency of feedback will be reviewed so that it produces less spam.
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Farlius
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Farlius » Thu Jun 14, 2018 2:26 am

I disagree on this addition, firstly, as it inhibits roleplay, secondly as it is mechanically enforced as a biproduct of the questing system already.

Consider that someone wishes to do training roleplay, or teaching in a field scenario. This now cannot be done without reducing all XP to 1 if the level range is too great.
Prior, it meant that you could quickly get someone through a dungeon and while yes, it reduced the XP to 1, you still received a benefit that far outweighed the loss due to the quicker run through, which in turn meant it was less intrusive to the large preformed groups of 3-4 people that want nothing to do with random "unknowns".

Additionally, the mechanical enforcement of when you may pick these quests already denies any collusion of extremely profitable circuits.
This does not deny a high level taking a low level to a dungeon far above their capacity, rather, it denies a high level helping a lowbie who is struggling as now there is no gain for either party aside from a 1XP grind and low gold return.

You have stated the level range is too generous, yellowcateyes, could you provide elaboration since that is rather unclear in what manner you mean?

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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Griefmaker » Thu Jun 14, 2018 3:50 am

Yeah, this is a pretty poor decision which serves only to stifle RP.

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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by MissEvelyn » Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:03 am

A change that indirectly discourages Roleplay is a bad change on a Roleplay server. We already have too many mechanics that only encourage min-maxers and powerbuilders in place. Please, for the love of Roleplay, don't let this server become a generic MMO.


Wrips
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Wrips » Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:13 am

Farlius nailed it in his first paragraph: it's mechanically redundant at best and contradictory at worst.

The opportunity to meet a band of lowbies roaming around and be able to tag along is invaluable to foster interaction and gives plenty of opportunity for some post dungeon RP - which in some, if not most instances, translates to acquitances you can interact with again in-game.

Not to say some epic characters might need the colaboration of third parties to further advance their RP agenda, parties that can get absent for quite some time due to RL constraints. This time could usually be used to meet and play with characters outside your bubble which, again, is invaluable for a proper RP experience.

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Peppermint
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Peppermint » Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:20 am

If you want to roleplay 'training', then do so in a level appropriate dungeon. If you instead want to hang in a low level dungeon with your friends, you're still welcome to. However, they won't learn much from it. Which makes sense. It's a roleplay server, right?

There are still plenty of reasons/avenues to hang with characters across a span of multiple levels. Players did this long before the writ system was introduced--and still will.

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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by yellowcateyes » Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:21 am

You're perfectly free to carry on roleplaying as you were before, unless the absence of mechanical reward is incompatible with the RP you enjoy.

Level considerations on XP gain exist for a reason. Partying with a level 30 will result in virtually no XP for killing a goblin. Writs have been brought in line with that, and are in fact far more generous in the range of levels that can work together and still be rewarded.
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Farlius
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Farlius » Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:42 am

yellowcateyes wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:21 am
You're perfectly free to carry on roleplaying as you were before, unless the absence of mechanical reward is incompatible with the RP you enjoy.

Level considerations on XP gain exist for a reason. Partying with a level 30 will result in virtually no XP for killing a goblin. Writs have been brought in line with that, and are in fact far more generous in the range of levels that can work together and still be rewarded.

Writs, as far as they work, present a problem that then rewards a player for completing it. In no way does this indicate they may not enlist help of others, and saying instead that just because a level 30 wants to help it should not be done is rather crude, if not outlandish.
Instead, what if a level 18 wants to help a level 12 but the level 12 takes an effectively level 11 writ? This just leads to "close" level characters now having no reason to involve themself beyond this "do it for the Rp alone" mentality.
The argument then to reduce this gap level further is not even a feasible matter. It is already hard enough to find help at your level with a non-descript writ system that fails to specify writ level, then reducing it to 5,4,3 will only change it to a biased "OOC Grouping" method.
Why should any RP you want to do mean that one party of the RP is punished? Mechanical benefit only applies to the lower levels in this case and how this is being adapted only serves to disuade that interaction between lower and high level characters.
Peppermint wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:20 am
If you want to roleplay 'training', then do so in a level appropriate dungeon. If you instead want to hang in a low level dungeon with your friends, you're still welcome to. However, they won't learn much from it. Which makes sense. It's a roleplay server, right?

There are still plenty of reasons/avenues to hang with characters across a span of multiple levels. Players did this long before the writ system was introduced--and still will.
Writs being included was and is a game changer. It encouraged and allowed with reason to undertake mid-adventure RP, but also meant that the more casual players could ask for aid from other people. It is not solely about the RP here, but rather how the two intermingle and as such is a benefit that comes from the system.
I cannot help but feel this was done to stop certain individuals, and as a result we are now being told both a branch of RP and a mechanical benefit are not allowed.

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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Gods_Kill_People » Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:01 am

Peppermint wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:20 am
If you want to roleplay 'training', then do so in a level appropriate dungeon. If you instead want to hang in a low level dungeon with your friends, you're still welcome to. However, they won't learn much from it. Which makes sense. It's a roleplay server, right?

There are still plenty of reasons/avenues to hang with characters across a span of multiple levels. Players did this long before the writ system was introduced--and still will.
Actually, I am going to correct you in your statement that a person won't learn much by watching. There IS more then one way to learn, this is why classrooms are redundant because they focus on only one teaching style, which is what is being forced here...one style is right and everyone else is wrong. Let me tell you the seven styles of Learning which CAN and IS applied IG with various characters..

Visual (spatial):You prefer using pictures, images, and spatial understanding.
Aural (auditory-musical): You prefer using sound and music.
Verbal (linguistic): You prefer using words, both in speech and writing.
Physical (kinesthetic): You prefer using your body, hands and sense of touch.
Logical (mathematical): You prefer using logic, reasoning and systems.
Social (interpersonal): You prefer to learn in groups or with other people.
Solitary (intrapersonal): You prefer to work alone and use self-study.

To say any one learning style is the only way to learn, which is exactly what your implying, is incorrect. I personally am a physical learner. Some are visual, learning by watching others. So please, do reconsider your stance on the matter. Thank you.

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Peppermint
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Peppermint » Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:10 am

Different things.

Your warrior will no more learn from someone else swinging a sword than I've learned archery from playing Neverwinter Nights.

But I'll leave it at that.

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Dean
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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Dean » Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:13 am

This server is a combination of good mechanics and good roleplay, you cannot remove one and expect the other to not suffer. You cannot say to just do it for the roleplay for that damages the mechanics, and if you say you should just do it for the experience that damages the roleplay.

I at the moment play a dex based character, I have been struggling to find people relative to my level to do writs. It is frustrating, there is little I can do with my own agency, which forces me to either wait days until I can finally meet another of my level. I have yet to really find one that is around my level.

I now cannot ask my higher level friends for help either. If this is the route you want to go I request some sort of LFG system, for it is demoralizing being stuck at low levels unable to get help or participate with my higher level friends due to the dangerous zones they go to.

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Re: "A member of your party..." (Writs feedback)

Post by Ork » Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:53 am

The "seven learning styles" is a myth.

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