Regeneration from iceberries.

[Invader_Nym]

What motivated the choice to remove regeneration from ice-berries? Many other summons regenerate. Tribal warriors and vampiric summons come to mind.

[Cortex]

ranger needed a nerf kappa

[Invader_Nym]

Now, because the bear has a 25 AC vs epic monsters, and the bear takes twice as long to kill them, and my cost in healing supplies has trippled, I'm just not going to use him.

Nerf successful. I'd add the healing back, at the very least.

[Griefmaker]

Now, because the bear has a 25 AC vs epic monsters, takes twice as long to kill them, and triples my cost in healing supplies, I'm just not going to use him.

Nerf successful.

Yeah...I have spoken with 4 rangers already that are pretty irritated by this change as well. For druids, it is not as big of a deal since they can cat regen. In that case, the +1 regen did not really help all that much.

Sadly, the drive to nerf has driven away the need for reason!

[BegoneThoth]

Mid 30's ac isn't really do able. And with them now running slow, trying to spam Player Tool 1 to get them to move/attack what they should be (instead of standing there getting snuck attack) is more irritating.

In my opinion this turned animal companions from a viable but underwhelming class feature into an rp toy. It can't survive packs in higher level areas anymore, as the ac difference just means it's going to eat on average one more attack per flurry. So it's not really viable.

[RedGiant]

Agree+++

Most animal companions have sucky ac, terrible saves, and three attacks. Before the Nerf, when fully prepared by a competent druid (not ranger), they could hold their own with other epic summons. Now, BT et al is right...subpar is probably too generous. I can't even imagine it on Rangers.

Honestly, the fourth attack and extra AC wasn't really over the top for something that can be easily undone (see crappy saves above) by the variety of anti-summoning tools out there.

Druid used to be my main, and I'm sure it works out for some weird new con dump druids, by my old bat totem is collectively ruined by all of these changes. I feel like weve gone to an unintentionally werid place with them, like in the days of old conlocks.

[Iceborn]

Honestly a rather odd change, considering that animal companions are kinda... mehish in vanilla, and there's only a few spells that make them remotely Not Sucky.

Hopefully we'll see some balancing so that there are companions that are remotely worth choosing other than dire wolf and bear.

[Invader_Nym]

Honestly a rather odd change, considering that animal companions are kinda... mehish in vanilla, and there's only a few spells that make them remotely Not Sucky.

Hopefully we'll see some balancing so that there are companions that are remotely worth choosing other than dire wolf and bear.

The awaken + permanent haste combo was too much offense and should have been nerfed: it allowed the animal companion to have 3 attacks at top attack bonus, which was too much.

I think the defense side of things was fine, and I think the damage mitigation nerfs to the ice-berries is unwarranted.

The movement speed bonus from the ice berries was a great damage mitigator. Often the bear will go aggro even if you put him on "hold position." Being able to pull him quickly out of battle was a great damage mitigator.

What about putting expeditious retreat on the iceberries, and/or returning the regeneration from the ice berries? The bear is a liability now, because you have to excessively micromanage him to keep him alive.

[Thanatosis]

Yeah...I have spoken with 4 rangers already that are pretty irritated by this change as well. For druids, it is not as big of a deal since they can cat regen. In that case, the +1 regen did not really help all that much.

Sadly, the drive to nerf has driven away the need for reason!

[BegoneThoth]

3 attacks at top attack bonus, very very powerful.

Either way I personally won't be recommending druids to anyone for the time being. The spell caster version just lost a ton of functionality, and it was already pretty bad. Dragon shapers didn't lose anything, but are still pretty meh, only can change three times per rest and can't fit through doors and get hung up on small stones. Monolith forums are ok if your end goal is to specifically not die to unprepared players, and that's just not fun.

Class is in a bad state having almost no role or doing anything well until 25\28, and I hope something changes so the class becomes enjoyable mechanically.

[flower]

In PVE druids often outshine most classes.

So having no role? Hmm.

[BegoneThoth]

In PVE druids often outshine most classes.

Justify that statement. Include AB and AC values and touch on what part of their spell list that gives them this value.

[flower]

I have no need to justify anything in front of you.

I travelled with several druids across many epic locations. Places where my 50 AC was not enough to prevent critcs for 70+ damage while druid tanked like six of these npcs at once, getting no real damage done on himself while npcs were burning alive slowly with each strike on him.

My close friend plays also druid now and he claims that easier the PVE has never been before, able to handle places where his caster (mage) needed my WM and my WM needed his caster.

Yet you claim that druid has no role and use now. Heh.

[BegoneThoth]

50 ac is not high I would consider it on the low end. 60+ is 'high' and many builds can sit in the 70`s.

Also pve is easy due to the ai being often restricted to physical plus one elemental damage type. Which is why it's op and trash at the same time. Against a player or in any fight where your weakness comes to count, you can't afford to shift out, and with no disc, except for rock you're kd bait.

It's not too hot.

[JediMindTrix]

I have no need to justify anything in front of you.

I think he meant 'back your statement up with some evidence'.

[flower]

I have no need to justify anything in front of you.

I think he meant 'back your statement up with some evidence'.

Evidence for me is that my friend can solo places where we needed high level and good gear before.

He laughs at his comments about druids. And also, pvp is not everything on this server.

[Nitro]

Anecdotal, adjective:
(of an account) not necessarily true or reliable, because based on personal accounts rather than facts or research.

That you needed high level and good gear doesn't say anything since we don't know what build you had, but if your earlier comment on 50AC was correct they likely weren't very good for end-game content.

Druids aren't very strong, they're just very hard to be bad at since you can't fudge up the build hard enough that the epic elemental forms can't carry you through lategame content, but they simultaneously aren't strong enough to compete with stronger, properly built, builds on their own either.

[flower]

That you needed high level and good gear doesn't say anything since we don't know what build you had, but if your earlier comment on 50AC was correct they likely weren't very good for end-game content.
.

Talking of current early epic character

Begone wrote that druid has no role and use, which is not true. He can reliebly do many places on his own and trough late game content can go very easily with a companion. And if he compares everything to the pvp, if the class has a role or not, if it is of use or no...it is irrelevant. On my last elf I had two pvps over almost a year...

[BegoneThoth]

Agreed. And there only 2 paths, EDR 3 or NOT EDR 3, neither are very attractive or, lets face it, fun.

As for their role, they're a fifth wheel as both a buffer and a melee.

As for PvP, always balance for PvP, always build for PvP, because PvE is binary. Either your group can do/you can solo it or can't. PvP is dynamic and changes frequently, and presents actually engaging gameplay beyond roleplay that doing RDI for the 40th time doesn't offer.

[flower]

Agreed. And there only 2 paths, EDR 3 or NOT EDR 3, neither are very attractive or, lets face it, fun.

As for their role, they're a fifth wheel as both a buffer and a melee.

As for PvP, always balance for PvP, always build for PvP, because PvE is binary. Either your group can do/you can solo it or can't. PvP is dynamic and changes frequently, and presents actually engaging gameplay beyond roleplay that doing RDI for the 40th time doesn't offer.

I am not sure the obssesion for pvp stands.

My first elf had like four pvp encounters in her existence.

My second elf had 2 pvps with drow and one pvp with some barbarian in Nomad, i played him almost a year.

My eilistraeen priestess fought like...4-5 PVPs in total, two fo them were just sudden attacks and kills of her enemies along with her Brother (shall i count it as pvp at all?) in a year.

My following elf had two pvps (one against fellow elf:P ).

Only now, my drow had already 3 fights, two times versus assasins (once not about him). But only because i chose to take part in it. If i wanted he could be left without pvp at all.

[Seven Sons of Sin]

I think it's problematic saying PvP is "engaging gameplay" when we're not really focused on that, we're focused on collaborative storytelling.

I get what you're saying, but I actually think it's highly problematic to engage in mechanics in a "pvp-only mindset."

You know that probably 99% of bad blood on this server is caused by PVP right? You know that there are winners and losers in PVP, and someone almost always walks away disgruntled? You know that PVP is highly circumstantial and almost totally out of your control?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with what flower is saying. It's acceptable to engage in mechanics from a PvE point of view and make evaluations out of this.

If we start to echo chamber too much, we are really going to create an impression that winning in PvP is the be all, end all.

Which it isn't. And never should be.

[Cataclysm of Iron]

I've coasted in a hilariously short period of time (as one of the oldies who remembers when a Lv30 took literally 6-9 months of several hours per day unless you relentlessly circlegrinded) to mid-high teens with my definitely-not-optimally-built druid without ever summoning my animal companion for combat.

I can certainly see how the nerf might pinch a bit if you're used to it but, at least for druids, they're 100% not needed for a fun and enjoyable PvE experience. Which is the majority of combat gameplay.

[Xanos950]

Agreed. And there only 2 paths, EDR 3 or NOT EDR 3, neither are very attractive or, lets face it, fun.

As for their role, they're a fifth wheel as both a buffer and a melee.

As for PvP, always balance for PvP, always build for PvP, because PvE is binary. Either your group can do/you can solo it or can't. PvP is dynamic and changes frequently, and presents actually engaging gameplay beyond roleplay that doing RDI for the 40th time doesn't offer.

What's this "roleplay" you guys speak of? I thought arelith was a PvP server? Kappa.

[Thanatosis]

Kappa.

looking at my screen computer (that displays the arelith webpage forums) with VERY lots of much disgusting

[RedGiant]

I blame Cortex for bringing this invasive species of a pokemon to the Arelith biome.