Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

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Ork
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Ork » Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:42 am

I mean the Noble gift is tied specifically to the two castles currently. I don't really know what you were expecting.

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Ironfoot
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Ironfoot » Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:12 am

I can already see playing socialist gnome spreading revolution of the workers against nobility har har.

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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Kuma » Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:25 am

Ironfoot wrote:I can already see playing socialist gnome spreading revolution of the workers against nobility har har.
I actually played (briefly) a Wild Mage Gnome from Lantan who was a Gondar extremist which manifested in Pretty Much Anarcho-Syndicalism.

i kinda want to pick him up again

EDIT: Incidentally, this thread reads a little high-strung. Surely one would read the documentation on what an award actually provides, and the documentation says absolutely nothing pertaining to the rather unique situation of Noble Underdarkers, and indeed very little at all. Just that NPCs will react differently.

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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Cerk Evermoore » Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:38 am

BegoneThoth wrote:You're a real noble and everyone who didn't spend a reward is literally a pretender.

+ Claim your true place. Even if they destroy you it only proves you are a noble and they are not.

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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by One Two Three Five » Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:55 am

Drow with the noble background should get a +6 ecl, more stat boosts, and be able to levitate.
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by BegoneThoth » Wed Nov 29, 2017 3:02 am

I mean, if you don't have the reward you're only a hair above a slave. No real drow would ever follow a drow commoner.

RP that hard. It's a good rp angle and strongly supported in the Lore.
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Xanos950
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Xanos950 » Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:52 pm

In normal FR lore? Totally.

In Arelith Andunor lore? No. Why? Because usually the House or Temple of Lolth would obliterate any commoner foolish enough to deny let alone lay hand on a true noble. Which isn't enforced on the server for obvious reason.

Just make your own house and pretend to be nobility like everyone else. At least in the UD the "noble reward" is a waste of a reward though.

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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by BegoneThoth » Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:06 am

Xanos950 wrote:In normal FR lore? Totally.

In Arelith Andunor lore? No. Why? Because usually the House or Temple of Lolth would obliterate any commoner foolish enough to deny let alone lay hand on a true noble. Which isn't enforced on the server for obvious reason.

Just make your own house and pretend to be nobility like everyone else. At least in the UD the "noble reward" is a waste of a reward though.
It should be enforced. There's a difference between being a real drow noble and just IC pretending to be one because you didn't get the reward.
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Astral » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:00 am

The thing about Nobles in Arelith... is that they are usually just considered as Snowflake as tieflings/dragons/etc. If you want to be a real noble your character has to hang around and show their nobility and leadership for awhile before the player base is going to treat you as a real noble, gift or not.
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Nitro » Thu Nov 30, 2017 11:38 am

BegoneThoth wrote:
Xanos950 wrote:In normal FR lore? Totally.

In Arelith Andunor lore? No. Why? Because usually the House or Temple of Lolth would obliterate any commoner foolish enough to deny let alone lay hand on a true noble. Which isn't enforced on the server for obvious reason.

Just make your own house and pretend to be nobility like everyone else. At least in the UD the "noble reward" is a waste of a reward though.
It should be enforced. There's a difference between being a real drow noble and just IC pretending to be one because you didn't get the reward.
I'd much rather see people who worked their way up to noble status via making (or working their way through) one of the player-made houses in game. If someone came along and demanded respect due for nobility because they spent a reward on it I'd be more inclined to laugh in their face. Sure, maybe they were a nobility where they came from, but this is Arelith. You start as a level 3 nobody no matter what reward you picked.

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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Mr_Rieper » Thu Nov 30, 2017 3:53 pm

As somebody RPing as a noble on the surface, it's a tricky situation. My character started out as somebody not worth any attention, a wandering bard from a destroyed noble family. I picked the noble background because it fit, not because I expected anything from it. At the time, it was just +1 art crafting.

Over time, my character was shaped into somebody who no longer hides from responsibility. I'd like to think that the reason he is noticeable is not because of his background or titles, but what the titles represent. He's the land lord of a rather large chunk of the Isle.

In the end, I think who you can influence and what you own is what gives the noble titles some power, and not much else. While it's great to spend a gift to be a noble and be recognised by NPCs for it, you can't expect other PCs to instantly give you respect for it. You need to be somebody worth recognising first.

This probably goes for all "special" characters though. Fresh off the boat, you're a nobody, even if you have dragon blood or a dark past. You have to work to be relevant, and that's fair, I think.

As for the UD, things shift a bit too quickly there. Which is good and bad. Great for fresh ideas, bad for consistency. And nobles represent a fair bit of consistency in a society.
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by BegoneThoth » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:07 pm

Nitro wrote:
BegoneThoth wrote:
Xanos950 wrote:In normal FR lore? Totally.

In Arelith Andunor lore? No. Why? Because usually the House or Temple of Lolth would obliterate any commoner foolish enough to deny let alone lay hand on a true noble. Which isn't enforced on the server for obvious reason.

Just make your own house and pretend to be nobility like everyone else. At least in the UD the "noble reward" is a waste of a reward though.
It should be enforced. There's a difference between being a real drow noble and just IC pretending to be one because you didn't get the reward.
I'd much rather see people who worked their way up to noble status via making (or working their way through) one of the player-made houses in game.
That's not how nobility works. It's family based.
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Lorkas » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:16 pm

Nobility is usually hereditary, but in many places you could also be granted nobility by a monarch. There's nothing wrong with the idea of someone working their way up to noble status (though they'll never have the background of nobility).

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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by BegoneThoth » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:19 pm

Lorkas wrote:Nobility is usually hereditary, but in many places you could also be granted nobility by a monarch. There's nothing wrong with the idea of someone working their way up to noble status (though they'll never have the background of nobility).
Then they're a pretender and the real nobility should treat them as such.

Frankly there should be an NPC in the Underdark that can tell you who the currently active nobles are, so the non-reward pretenders can be punished. Would solve this whole issue.
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Nitro » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:21 pm

BegoneThoth wrote: That's not how nobility works. It's family based.
Luckily, we're playing a game, not living in medieval Europe. It doesn't make sense for a fresh level 3 character to come in and demand respect from hardened high level veterans who've been around for years and potentially created or helped others make their own noble houses.
Arelith Wiki wrote:The Noble background implies that the character belongs to a manner or another of aristocracy. More importantly, Noble characters are recognized by some NPCs as nobles and may behave, or offer different options to these characters.
This is all it says about it, nothing about other players recognizing you for it, or that you have some special authority. Just like everyone else on Arelith you'll have to work to earn that.

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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by BegoneThoth » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:42 pm

Nitro wrote:
BegoneThoth wrote: That's not how nobility works. It's family based.
Luckily, we're playing a game, not living in medieval Europe. It doesn't make sense for a fresh level 3 character to come in and demand respect from hardened high level veterans who've been around for years and potentially created or helped others make their own noble houses.
Arelith Wiki wrote:The Noble background implies that the character belongs to a manner or another of aristocracy. More importantly, Noble characters are recognized by some NPCs as nobles and may behave, or offer different options to these characters.
This is all it says about it, nothing about other players recognizing you for it, or that you have some special authority. Just like everyone else on Arelith you'll have to work to earn that.
Well the wiki is, as im learning, basically always wrong.

Additionally, an upstart noble pooping on non-noble but well known UDers is an RP angle and should be explored IC. It may be 'common' here for 'common' drow to accomplish things and even rise to a level that may resemble nobility, but they still lack the proper bloodlines and features that true noble have.

And believe it or not, typical drow care a lot about their bloodlines and the noble families they serve. It's very important.
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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Lorkas » Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:01 pm

There's a vast difference between being named a noble and making a false claim of nobility. Ultimately, the rules for nobility in any area is determined by who's in power in that area. In Arelith, you have to take the noble background to be a noble by family line, but that doesn't mean you can't earn it in game, either by some person in power naming you a noble or through becoming a person in power yourself and then naming yourself a noble.

It's perfectly fine from an IC perspective for not everyone to buy someone's claim of nobility, but this idea of OOC enforcement of nobility that you seem to want is wrong about how nobility works--it's always the ruling class in any area that determines what nobility means and how it is gained. In any case, an overhaul to the nobility system is in the works, as I understand it, and if I'm not mistaken, it includes a way to earn it after character creation.

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Re: Nobility award has no effect on UDers?

Post by Gods_Kill_People » Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:56 pm

This has derailed very far off topic and I don't really want a flame war started so can we please lock this until the update goes through? Thanks.

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