Questions regarding the Bardadin build

[Dr. B]

Have you ever played a bard?

Yes, I played Gwynyvere Morgenstern.

You seem to be mixing up Still Spell and Silent Spell. Still Spell does nothing against silence.

Incorrect. Still Spell allows you to cast Ethereal Visage in armor, which renders you immune to silence *and* which lacks a verbal component.

But Qirrova didn't have Still Spell, so perhaps you forgot about this.

I already noted paranthetically in my previous post that the Bardadin is quite powerful before level 30. It's an "endgame" build in the sense that the Holy Grail of the build, Lasting Inspiration, isn't available 'til 30.

Mundanes do have to cast from wands and potions. Given the option of not having to do so, however, I think most players would choose the latter.

[Peppermint]

I didn't forget. Though I also hadn't assumed you were referring to stilling Ethereal Visage.

As an alternative, you could 1) rely on consumables, or 2) just wear the Spell Resistance helmet/RH ring, which negate Silence consumables anyway. This leaves casters as the only silencing threat to you--a threat that I'd argue would be far greater given the ability to strip every buff (including Ethereal Visage) from you.

To each their own, though.

As I said, both are options. However, shilling Still Spell as "expert consensus" is disingenuous at best. A large number of the 'Git Gud' members would not take that approach (myself included).

[Lasos]

Dr B., you mentioned that you had played a Bardadin to level 30 with Still Spell (which I've decided to use). I'm interested in your take on the Concentration discussion. Did you find much use for it? Would you max it, keep it at 20 (to allow combat casting for level 5 spells not provoking AOO), or do you think one could possibly drop it entirely without hurting too much? It seem like keeping it at 20 is a bit of a waste. While it could allow you to potentially avoid AOO, should anyone still manage to hit you regardless of that, probably you are going to have a hard time beating the concentration check. I also think that it is not possible to have Combat Casting mode and Expertise mode active at the same time, so that's probably also going to feel a bit weird, but I will have to test that.

[Dr. B]

should anyone still manage to hit you regardless of that, probably you are going to have a hard time beating the concentration check. I also think that it is not possible to have Combat Casting mode and Expertise mode active at the same time, so that's probably also going to feel a bit weird, but I will have to test that.

Concentration is still useful without defensive casting mode (which I never used on my Bard) simply because it allows you to avoid spell disruption. The 20 concentration is recommended for the purposes of making leveling easier. The DC to avoid spell disruption is equal to 10 + damage received + spell level. If you choose to use your spell book, then dropping concentration entirely will make it far too easy for many creatures to beat this DC. I therefore highly recommend taking at least 20.

If you choose to invest more than 20 than I would suggest maximizing concentration to 33. You will have to drop Heal to do so, however. This will give you more immunity to disruption but also make you resistant to taunts. Is this generally more handy than Heal? In my experience, no; its use is much more situational and limited mostly to PvP, and not having the Heal skill will make leveling much more painful.

[dallion43]

1. A knok, preferably improved on a build that can deliver -8disc on target while having relevant AB is essential.
(Not to mention TS + -8, and no, you can't always outrun a TS, especially in a mess and/or lag).
2. In a build that focuses on more then two stats losing one gear slot is detrimental. Don't forget that helm/armor is usually 1 stat max.
Usually that extra slot means more even cont that on lvl 30 will give +30hp that will replace toughness.
Lets not forget that unless you use pots only, cont buff is unreliable due to mords etc.
3. still spell vs extra epic feat? Somewhat depends on your gear.
https://nwn.fandom.com/wiki/Bard_song = see how much perform you need to get -8. Usually song comes before curse allowing less actual
perform to net 50. Make sure you have 50 even after cha buff is potentially dispelled.
Calculate your saves with gear on test server. Make sure you have enough extra disc(from gear) NOT under song.
Same with perform and even a bit spellcraft if it fits to gain a bit more saves.
Calculate how much gold you will need to get that gear, and if you think you can(want) to get enough 3 lvl runes to have relevant maxed gear.
You do need 40fort, and relevant will(especially now, yes you have fear pal, still).
40 fort, ~60 disc(presong), ~35+will, calculate perform song+cha.
Considering above maybe you will see a value in esf.disc or es.fort.
Prowless/imp.knok is a matter of min/maxer taste with full costly gear+pots.
4. Ethereal visage is high in the breach list, meaning it will be gone after one lesser breach. I do recommend the sr helm.
5. While both approaches are valuable, I personally believe heal+more.umd(+1ab,blind,etc)+point 3 > conc+still.
Yes sonic shield is great. Unfortunately netting you a 20 caster lvl on the spot. You want +2ab? Squeeze the ball for 9 rounds.

Of course the above is an imho, and since I don't have the mighty badge(lol without a doubt, just lol...) you don't have to take it seriously -).

p.c Don't forget bards have a cheat harp in carpentry and another lesser cheat harp.