Ranger Help

[Hot Tamale]

Hey guys!

So, I have a pretty decent idea of "What" I want to play, both build and concept. But I'm unsure which will have the best End-Game, and which is worth actually pursuing. Anyways, here goes!

The general idea is a Drow whom is a Ranger. His skillset will focus on being a Slave tracker. So heavily focused in Spot or Search (Which ever is perhaps best for a concept like this). He'll be primary Ranger, I am thinking maybe 21 or 23.

1.) Strength-Based Ranger that uses the Spear. In particular End-Game goal is Elder Dream. He'd have 16 Charisma (+2 Subrace), 16 Intelligence (+2 Subrace), and 24 Strength. As well as the Gift of Tongues. General feats include Overwhelming Critical: Spear, BoE, and ESF: Spot, Discipline or Search. As well as Blackguard level for Divine Might and Divine Shield. Lastly a Rogue dump for Tumble and UMD. Also considering have him serve Toril for the use of Spells. Which might contradict the whole Blackguard concept, so also I probably won't.

Elder Dream
(Damage Bonus: 2d6 Divine Damage
Enhancement Bonus: +4
Keen
Runic
Light: Dim (5m) Green
Use: Barkskin (12) 3/day
Use: Nature's Balance (15) 1/day
Use: Sleep (2) Unlimited/day
Only Useable By: Druid
Only Useable By: Ranger
UMD Requirement: 55)

2.) Is essentially the same, but Dex based, and uses a Whip. Ranger (23) / Blackguard (4) / Rogue (3).

Lastly, I plan to have them as a Carpenter. Though Herbalism for Poisons would be fun.

[CosmicOrderV]

With both options, I'm assuming shield would be the other hand?

[Hot Tamale]

Mhm. Str based will be Spear (Endgame / Elder's), and with Dex I'm considering anything dex-based. Idc.

[CosmicOrderV]

It seems to me like you already have a pretty good idea of how to accomplish what you want.

I would say, though, you could probably end up a lot tankier, for only a minimal loss of damage, by going Expertise and Improved Expertise, instead of all the prereq's for Overwhelming Critical. Same by going bard for spellcraft dump, instead of rogue. But. If offense is your thing, you definitely seem to have a solid path of achieving it.

[Drowble Oh Seven]

I'll echo COV here. Overwhelming critical's not worth the investment for a ranger (and you absolutely don't have the feats to spare on it, particularly if you're set on the divine feats). It's only debateably worth it for weapon masters, and they'll be critting a lot more than you are. Take expertise / improved expertise. You need them to live.

The strength build's far preferable for playability. You just won't get any real damage as a melee dex build, even with Bane of Enemies; and you don't meet the prerequisites for epic dodge which (unless you're playing an archer) is really the only compelling reason to go DEX.

Bard is better for your dip. You get evasion already as a ranger, so you're better off taking advantage of bard to get spellcraft and shore up your saves. If you're looking for a more outsider-y flavour to your RP, you can even convert them to warlock levels (with the side benefit of getting six more hit points!).

It's hard to recommend the divine feats for this build, given what you need to sacrifice to make them effective - and the fact that you already need fairly respectable scores in STR, CON, INT and WIS already to get the most out of ranger. Those 16 points in charisma would be better spent on CON, given your base stat lineup's going to be pretty lacking in it. A lack of HP is a painful choice in a front-liner. You can always invest in bluff and use -mimic to up what appears on your description. I say this as someone currently playing a 10 CON ranger (I am made of Plasticine). That said, if you're fixed on them, let me know and I'll see if I can't hammer out a feat list for you.

Edit: Removed some incorrect info on divine feats!

[Ork]

Just a quick correct. You can take divine might and shield with only 4 blackguard levels. Feats at L3 BG & L4 BG with 2 levels of ranger in between.

[Drowble Oh Seven]

Ah, of course. Forgot about that. Thanks for the correction!

[Oshido]

If you are lucky you can get Elder Dream before level 20. Just make the right friends.
I am currently playing something lime this. 21 ranger 6 fighter soon 3 bard or rogue. I went fighter first 4 levels so I could keep my wisdom at 8 and sink points into dex. Started at 13 dex so I can potion for 5 to max out ranger runic armour.
Also to get better cl from scrolls etc.
I went imp exp. with regular kd and mounted combat. and feats for overwhelming crit.
I really like the damage and playability of this guy. 2d6 divine, 4 ench, keen, 1d6 temp, overwhelming crit for 3d6, bane of enemies, blade thirst, 2d6 sneak if rogue. I don't sneak as I ride, but I do spot.

[Kenji]

You can't cast blade thirst with wisdom 8.

Taking 4 fighter levels pre-epic will be a net loss of 1 epic feat and 1 Favored Enemy.

Dex can be boosted via Skleen, Cat's Grace, and +2 dex from runic armor itself to fill the Runic Ranger Leather's AC bonus. (That means only a roll of 4 on Cat's Grace is needed with 10 dex to max out Ranger leather's AC dex bonus)

[Oshido]

I have 8 wisdom, and I cast it all the time. From scrolls etc.

[Kenji]

If you can find a steady supplier of Blade Thirst wand or scroll, then by all means! The vampiric property scale with ranger levels, which is nice.

At the same time, I'd trade the 5 or 6 points from Wisdom into more Strength if possible while not putting in as much for Dex. Losing 1 epic feat essentially means losing 1 main stat, overall. Unless the 13 dex is used for fulfilling a certain requirement such as WM's dodge and mobility (Which is a bad idea, btw, Ranger's 21 levels and WM's 7 levels don't play nicely together), the trade off here is essentially spellcasting vs easier time to hit 4 dex AC cap.

Depending on the ranger build, if one intends to pvp, then that means the ranger will have to pick 4 out of the gnome, half-elf, aberration, outsider, giant, or undead for Favored Enemies. Having 1 less option will hurt it further more.

[Drowble Oh Seven]

Does the weapon enchantment bonus scale as well if you're casting blade thirst from wands/scrolls, or is it just the vampiric regen property?

Because if you're on a +3 weapon, 21 ranger levels will make it a +4 anyway, which lands you the same AB as if you'd thrown those six points in strength to start with - as well as all your ranger spellcasting. Less relevant for these spear-swinging builds which get a +4 elder dream, but I'm curious.

Admittedly you'll still have the problem with dispels shredding your ranger buffs with 21 levels, but it does feel like a shame to me to play a ranger and miss out on all their spells.

--
As an aside; it's easy (not optimal, but easy) to pick up GSF: Transmutation on rangers since you can take the GSF on a favoured enemy feat. It helps a bit with buffing and wand use, as well as giving you the ability to pop up everywhere with teleport. There are better choices as far as effectiveness goes, but I enjoy having it. It's fun to RP knowing hidden ways and secret passages.