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Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:11 pm
by Truesight
I've been thinking of a concept build with a versatile martial class that can do melee and range as well as having some non-damage tricks.

I think I've settled on a pure 30 ranger. Using Elder dream and shield for melee and all the melee goody feats and the sniper class and bow for ranged options. I'd appreciate any input in terms of optimising the concept/ discussing it's viability. Also input on what 13 favoured/studied enemies to take and when.


Current build:

Ranger - Sniper Path
Human
Str 14 (16 after gift) (24)
Dex 14 (16 after gift)
Con 14
Wis 14
Int 14
Cha 8

1 Expertise + Improved Expertise, Favoured Enemy + point blank shot, rapid shot
3 Weapon Focus spear
5 Favoured Enemy, Studied Enemy
6 Weapon Focus Longbow
9 Imp Crit Spear, called shot
10 Favoured Enemy, Studied Enemy
12 Knockdown
15 Disarm+ Favoured Enemy, Studied Enemy
18 Blind Fight
20 Favoured Enemy, Studied Enemy
21 Bane of Enemies
23 Epic Weapon Focus Spear
24 Armour Skin
25 Epic Weapon Focus Longbow, Studied Enemy
26 Favoured Enemy
27 Epic Prowess
29 Favoured Enemy
30 Epic Strength + Favoured Enemy, Studied Enemy

Comes stock with a level 30 companion with Magic fang buffs, +8 favoured enemy and +8 sniper damage (ranged only unfortunately) and HIPS.

Re: Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 5:47 pm
by Freyason
It will be suboptimal but it will survive. Why not go weapon finesse with rapier instead so you can concentrate on dex/con instead.

Elder spear really makes no sense for high level ranger (actually been trying to figure out a build that would use it, ever, for a long time haha).

Re: Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:41 pm
by afreshstart
Elder dream is more of a shifter weapon imho

Re: Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:02 pm
by Baron Saturday
There's actually a Ranger Favored & Studied Enemy Guide that goes over what races you might want to pick for that!

As for this build, there's some weaknesses that have to be acknowledged. You have to CC tumble, which is a loss of 3 AC. No UMD isn't totally crippling for PvE, as you'll still have access to some/most divine wands, but will likely be an issue in PvP. Your will save is going to be garbage. Assuming your gear focuses on str/dex, you'll be somewhat squishy with ~360 HP. Your ranged AB will be mediocre at best (~43 v. favored enemies). Your AC probably won't be great? But honestly my brain isn't working well enough to figure that out right now. There's probably other stuff, and I'd go into more detail on stats and gearing, but I'm having a terrible time focusing.

I think the 14 (!!!) favored/studied enemies will be the saving grace of this build, as you'll get 2 AB and 2d6+7 damage against them. You will definitely struggle against non-favored enemies.

Best of luck if you go with this build, and definitely let us know how it turns out!

Re: Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:03 pm
by Baron Saturday
afreshstart wrote:
Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:41 pm
Elder dream is more of a shifter weapon imho
Elder Dream is great for a str-based ranger btw.

Re: Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:40 pm
by afreshstart
It's better to go shortswords or kukris if you wan't to use a shield as a ranger I think. You can switch to dual weilding when the shield is not needed and deal more damage then you'd with the spear.

Re: Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:48 am
by Truesight
Thanks guys, it seems it will be suboptimal but not unviable which works I guess.
Any thoughts on the benefits of cross classing? For example would giving up the 7 levels of ranger for 4 fighter/3 bard be worthwhile? (Would it be possible to Epic weapon Spec in Spear and Longbow?)

Dual wielding is likely going to be difficult as if I go normal ranger I lose the sniper feats for Dual Wielding ones, and I need to find two feats for Point blank and Rapid shot.

Re: Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:07 am
by afreshstart
Well elder dream is a good choice if you'll pick a path but still there are better items to build around, but a bit harder to obtain (like blade of elements a long sword,if you 5% keen it you are golden) and I don't think you can grab 2 EWFs with 4 fighter levels.

Re: Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:31 am
by TimeAdept
Anyone who 5% keens a Blade of the Elements should also buy a lottery ticket that week.

Re: Spear and Bow Ranger

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:32 pm
by Baron Saturday
Truesight wrote:
Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:48 am
Thanks guys, it seems it will be suboptimal but not unviable which works I guess.
Any thoughts on the benefits of cross classing? For example would giving up the 7 levels of ranger for 4 fighter/3 bard be worthwhile? (Would it be possible to Epic weapon Spec in Spear and Longbow?)

Dual wielding is likely going to be difficult as if I go normal ranger I lose the sniper feats for Dual Wielding ones, and I need to find two feats for Point blank and Rapid shot.
23 ranger/4 fighter/3 rogue is definitely a more "standard" build. No way you'd be able to pick up EWS for both spear and longbow, though - that's four extra feats you'd need to cram in, all of them available only at fighter 4 or higher. Personally I would suggest focusing on the melee weapon.

If you wanted to go for a dual-wield ranger, you'd basically want to skip point blank shot (since you'll be switching to melee at that range anyhow), drop disarm and choose between rapid shot and called shot - I'd do called shot, as it can also be used in melee. Honestly, though? Trying to focus both longbow and spear just feels like a huge headache, resulting in an awkward str/dex hybrid.