Mighty Rage or Epic Weapon Focus?

[nobs3]

Last feature to take: mighty rage (next to the other two rages) OR Epic Weapon Focus (+2 AB)

What to do? (pure barb)

"Mighty Rage removes crowd control effects and debuffs, and extends rage by 1 turn."

What does that mean exactly? Would it remove fear for example? Or domination? Or hold spell effects?

The character is build on rage and +1 turn is good... but also your temp hp would need to last longer...

Ideas? Arguments?

[Cortex]

On activation, it would remove any disabling debuff you currently have. Fear, paralyzes, petrification, etc.

[nobs3]

That you Cortex for making this clear.

(This option would be more useful if you could activate mighty rage separate / during rage (with an extra cooldown); e.g. when you decide you need an extra duration or when you get negative effects in rage. Otherwise it is a feature for situations when you wait for the second rage period during a fight. But with that feature it would need a long fight for that.)

[Lorkas]

Yep, it's obviously for surprise CC rather than something to make you immune to them.

Still, it increases your rage uptime significantly. It's worth it just for that. In fact, if even argue it is the aspect of the feat that will be more useful overt the character's lifetime.

[Zavandar]

EDIT: THIS POST IS INCORRECT
Keep in mind that the interaction mighty has with terrifying is counterintuitive. Longer rages means fewer rages, which means less uptime on terrifying's debuff.

[Lorkas]

Keep in mind that the interaction mighty has with terrifying is counterintuitive. Longer rages means fewer rages, which means less uptime on terrifying's debuff.

Terrifying's debuff can apply every time that an enemy enters the aura, and doesn't the aura persist throughout the rage?

[Zavandar]

Just to have it here for reference and discussion:

Upon entering the aura of a raging barbarian with the Terrifying Rage feat, a hostile creature or player must make a will save.
The save DC is 5 + Intimidate / 5 + Hit Dice / 2 + base CON modifier. This is treated as a saving throw vs fear.
Against non-PCs, Terrifying Rage causes a 3-round stun and its debuff effect lasts three times longer.
Hit dice comparisons have been removed. Anyone that fails the saving throw is subject to the following effects:
Debuff: -1 to AB and Saves per 7 Barbarian levels
Debuff: +5% Automatic Spell Failure per 7 Barbarian levels
1/2 round stun
The debuff duration is 1d3 + base CON mod rounds. Mind protection defends against the stun effect, but not the debuff. Fear immunity protects against Terrifying Rage.

I think we may have different interpretations of how it works. In the event it can be refreshed right before the aura expires, then yeah, mighty is not a problem. Does this mean, though, that every time someone enters and exits the aura, they have a chance to be stunned as well?

That's silly if so. Because there is a stun involved, that would means that it's possible to literally run circles around something to keep them permanently stunned.

[Lorkas]

Yes, if you exit and reenter the aura, you can be stunned again. It's stopped by mind immunity our a successful save though, and a barbarian that's running is a barbarian that's not attacking.

In any case, if the new barbarian meta became "build for Terry rage DC and ruin in circles", you can bet it will be changed.

[yellowcateyes]

I mean, it's possible but it's highly inefficient.

You could have a level 30 barbarian running around in circles, landing half round stuns each with their own saving throw.

Or you could have a level 21 wizard with a focus, doing the same thing for an extended duration, except with a higher DC on a single saving throw.

If an epic barbarian is trying to keep you permanently stunned on the edge of his aura, then he's not accomplishing much while squandering his rounds in Rage. And all you need is a single good saving throw to get a window in which to quaff a clarity potion.

[Zavandar]

That's in pvp, yes. The stun is 3 rounds against npc's.

Either way, I talked out my behind earlier about the counterintuitive interaction. Will edit.

[nobs3]

Terrifying rage is good against many NPCs. Passing some spawns and scaring them and then rushing into an other larger group is a good tactic to gain some time and grand party members a good start.
For me it fits good to barb rp.
Walking back and forth to make the aura work an second time is silly in a fight.
Still it could be useful if you try to catch a slave...

I still have the option to take my last level. And the question still is +2AB or mighty rage... - I tend to rage. But I am just not sure how much the +2 AB matter.

(On the other hand: Most fights end when rage is still up... And walking while rage is up makes rp a bit more hectic

[Astral]

Honestly if you got to a point where you really have to pick between these two (which I don't know how you got to this point because both of these feats are top priority above all other epic feats for barbarian) go for Mighty Rage. This extra -pray charge + extra minute on rage are going to save your life way more times than +2 ab and your offense will suffer 10% chance to hit, which as I said, its a big deal imo but not as the previous.

[nobs3]

Honestly if you got to a point where you really have to pick between these two (which I don't know how you got to this point because both of these feats are top priority above all other epic feats for barbarian) ...

Pure barb and 3xdmg red and 2xrage... works quite well

I talked with other barb players and some (like me) don't want to be stuck in rage too long - partly for rp reasons.

If mighty rage would reduce the cooldown like this: 1min - barb lvl /6 (rounded down) rounds then it would be much more interesting.


(Last night my barb was paralyzed during a rage fight. -pray was already used. So mighty rage might help here. But to use it my character would need to wait about 2min + 1min = 3min. Thats quite a long time to stay alive paralyzed... So I fear mighty rage would not help much during a battle. And extra hp alsoe would come 1min later...)

[dallion43]

If you go 27barb/3fighter at the price of 1/-,0.5*3 lvls worth hps,1 damage,1 will save and 21 lvls on terrify you should get your missing feat.
Some fights last a bit longer due to maneuvers etc. Consider PDks, bards etc etc, sometimes holding off the rage for a round/two can be beneficial if you can remove all debuffs etc.
Since it is a free action it won't interrupt your pounding but force him to recurse song you again etc.
(If it works against curse song/pdk ab oppressor,I guess it should?)

P.C
26/4 fighter with some minor additional loses can give you additional feat like ESF:heal or ESF:taunt or something of this caliber depending on your build.
26/4 fighter can also help you reach 25str(+1apr max ab) since base 25str and 21con is difficult to achieve.

[Astral]

(Last night my barb was paralyzed during a rage fight. -pray was already used. So mighty rage might help here. But to use it my character would need to wait about 2min + 1min = 3min. Thats quite a long time to stay alive paralyzed... So I fear mighty rage would not help much during a battle. And extra hp alsoe would come 1min later...)

Unlike Clerics who want to buff before they charge into fight, a Mighty Rage barbarian wants to "sit" on their rage and save it for when they are stuck in CC. So they start the combat, draw out enemy abilities/CDs or whatever and then when they fail the save they roar in rage and break out of the CC, a lot stronger, with refreshed hp pool, etc.

26/4 fighter with some minor additional loses can give you additional feat like ESF:heal or ESF:taunt or something of this caliber depending on your build. 26/4 fighter can also help you reach 25str(+1apr max ab) since base 25str and 21con is difficult to achieve.

This is true. Taking 4 fighter lvls in epics wont stop a barbarian from RPing the same theme exactly but you'll have 3 extra feats to work with. Pure barbarian is a huge over-kill.

[nobs3]

Thank you all for those responses!

(If I ever will play an other barb my next build will be different. But atm it is great fun to play that "huge over-kill" pure barb

The low AC and other reasons makes it reasonable to charge raged from battle to battle... (PvM ... PvP is too seldom in my rp to focus my build on.)

(oh and: +4 lvl fighter would be +3 feat but -1 epic barb feature = + two more feat.)