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3d6InOrder
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by 3d6InOrder » Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:28 am
Zavandar wrote:And the more "traditional" variant here:
This build works great as a human, and also as a dwarf/duergar. Dwarves effectively have exotic through free dwarven waraxe feats. Regular elves not so much because their dex isn't that useful, but sun elves can work.
Thank you for this and also everybody for all the insight on Spellswords in this thread.
I’ve decided to play this as an item creating dwarf. Therefore I will probably lose ESF Abjuration, ESF Transmutation and AD Abjuration replacing these with ESF Enchantment, Craft Wand, Brew Potion, Empower Spell and one other feat.
Will this be viable in all PVE content? I’m assuming so, played carefully.
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taoofbalance
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by taoofbalance » Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:38 am
How useful is Epic Mage Armor for a Spellsword?
I'm wondering how much extra AC it actually gives you when you take into account all the other spells and wands you can use to push your AC to its limit.
*Edit. Also. I'm looking at swapping out Epic Spell Focus Aburation for Epic Skill Focus Discipline. I don't see much use for the Epic Abjuration since I can't use the capstone abilities of it.
** Edit. I should not that the character is a STR build wearing full-plate with a Tower shield. Don't know if that matters.
Last edited by
taoofbalance on Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:44 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Terenfel
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by Terenfel » Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:41 am
about 2 armor, 1 deflection, and 3 dodge for about 6 AC. just 3 dodge if you have a level 15 or higher cleric friend.
the kicker is epic mage armor cant be breached or dispelled.. so if someone casts Disjuncton on you our AC will not go down from losing shadow shield and shield, and only 1 from losing mage armor
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One Two Three Five
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by One Two Three Five » Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:18 pm
Epic mage armor is absolutely necessary I'd say. +20 undispellable AC? That way you don't have to worry about AC on gear. Relying on wands and comparatively short duration buffs isn't going to be a good time. It's a decent upgrade.
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High Primate
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by High Primate » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:44 pm
Zavandar wrote:@High Primate & Freyason
Waiting until epics to take monk could, in theory, save you from taking exotic.
The problem is budgeting your feats. How would you move the two pre-epic feats you use for wf: kama and exotic into epics?
Oops! My bad.
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Maladus
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by Maladus » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:57 pm
Quick feat question: is SF: Transmutation and GSF: Transmutation worth giving up any combination of AD: Abjuration, Imp. Critical, or Empower Spell? I made my character using a build from the first page prior to the changes to the Transmutation Spell Foci and I can still squeeze it into my build if I get rid of two of those feats listed above but I'm not sure if I would be gaining enough to make it worth it. Any thoughts?
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Zavandar
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by Zavandar » Mon Dec 18, 2017 5:13 pm
With the changes to hear that are being implemented with rune rafting, MAD characters are actually more viable. Believe it or not, spellswords sort of are one such class. This is because you need to stack int to maximize your damage. This is much easier to achieve with transmutation focuses.
Keep in mind, the DC to dispel a 23/4/3 is already 38. Mord scrolls cap at 37, so you're already not going to get dispelled by them. As such, I think as: abjur is a luxury, not a necessity. I've also gotten along just fine with maximize and extend.
Intelligence is too important
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Maladus
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by Maladus » Mon Dec 18, 2017 6:08 pm
Ok cool, I was leaning towards removing AD: Abjuration and Empower Spell from my repetoire anyway since I will have Extend and Maximize for metamagic. I'll also still have room for SF and GSF: Abjuration to up that dispel defense.
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Astral
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by Astral » Mon Dec 18, 2017 9:32 pm
I think both abjuration and transmutation are equally important on a spellsword. Abjuration also scales with your dispells, not just your resistance to dispells, and also makes you immune to missile storms which are kind of a problem for a character with buffed hp of 400ish. Its worth and not too difficult to squeeze them in the build.
Currently playing: Seth Xylo
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Maladus
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by Maladus » Tue Dec 19, 2017 1:00 am
Astral wrote:I think both abjuration and transmutation are equally important on a spellsword. Abjuration also scales with your dispells, not just your resistance to dispells, and also makes you immune to missile storms which are kind of a problem for a character with buffed hp of 400ish. Its worth and not too difficult to squeeze them in the build.
My build still has room to fit the Spell Focuses into Abkuration, but to fit Spell Focuses for Trnamuation I would have to drop two feats. That’s why I’ve chosen Arcane Defense: Abjuration and Empower Spells to be replaced by SF: Transmutation and GSF: Transmutation.
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Improv
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by Improv » Tue Dec 19, 2017 1:03 am
Scurvy Cur wrote:It's probably going to come out worse by a good margin, actually. From my tinkering with Spellsword, they usually have plenty of pre epic feats, and can afford the exotic prof, but blowing an epic feat on a build that gets a lot of mileage out of:
EMA
EWF
Askin
Eprow
ESF: Disc
ESF: Trans
ESF: Abj
And probably already lacks the room to take all of them is a very painful proposition.
Just to discuss out of curiosity.. Epic Prowess is good but it's just +1, I don't know that blowing a pre-epic feat just to get +1 in epic levels is such a priority when you could have the utility another metamagic would bring (like quicken for survivability or empower for another row of missile storms). That seems like a "your mileage may vary" thing to me but unless you're totally starved for AB..?
Also why ESF: Abj? I see GSF as very good but without the -ward feature another +2 on the dispels you cast isn't all that great unless you're constantly PVPing battlepriests, is it?
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Ozzy.nl
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by Ozzy.nl » Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:05 pm
With all the spell buffs, would it even have use for a spellsword to wear anything that adds AC like a mithil plate or a enchanted fine silk vest. Or would all the buffa simple write over those added AC scores?
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afreshstart
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by afreshstart » Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:19 pm
Ozzy.nl wrote:With all the spell buffs, would it even have use for a spellsword to wear anything that adds AC like a mithil plate or a enchanted fine silk vest. Or would all the buffa simple write over those added AC scores?
Yes you'll get +AC from your boots only. Unless you obtain a +6 item somehow
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Maladus
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by Maladus » Tue Dec 19, 2017 4:06 pm
I wear Greensteel Splint Mail, not sure if there are better options out there or not.
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Scurvy Cur
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by Scurvy Cur » Tue Dec 19, 2017 4:54 pm
Improv wrote:Scurvy Cur wrote:It's probably going to come out worse by a good margin, actually. From my tinkering with Spellsword, they usually have plenty of pre epic feats, and can afford the exotic prof, but blowing an epic feat on a build that gets a lot of mileage out of:
EMA
EWF
Askin
Eprow
ESF: Disc
ESF: Trans
ESF: Abj
And probably already lacks the room to take all of them is a very painful proposition.
Just to discuss out of curiosity.. Epic Prowess is good but it's just +1, I don't know that blowing a pre-epic feat just to get +1 in epic levels is such a priority when you could have the utility another metamagic would bring (like quicken for survivability or empower for another row of missile storms). That seems like a "your mileage may vary" thing to me but unless you're totally starved for AB..?
Also why ESF: Abj? I see GSF as very good but without the -ward feature another +2 on the dispels you cast isn't all that great unless you're constantly PVPing battlepriests, is it?
YMMV, but I've always found the increased bonus to dispels to be one of the best tools in the PvP kit that a class can have against any prepared opponent. It's not just battleclerics, it's mages, paladins, bards, the other spellsword, the mundane guy who's stacked 17 different wand buffs, etc. A successful dispel of crucial buffs wins fights. It also improves your magic imbue, for what that's worth, since when that thing procs, it fires a gdispel at your caster level with focii taken into account.
Re: Epic prowess, yes, you definitely want it. The main thing that most spellswords will have problems with is getting the AB to enable their first few hits with the fire imbue to reliably land. Anyone that's passing up epic prowess to save themselves a pre epic feat is making a very problematic choice.
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Astral
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by Astral » Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:49 pm
Maladus wrote:I wear Greensteel Splint Mail, not sure if there are better options out there or not.
About that.
I see that spellsword path reduces your asf by 5%. So what do you do with the remaining 5%? you live with it or you found a way to negate it to 0%?
Currently playing: Seth Xylo
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Scurvy Cur
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by Scurvy Cur » Tue Dec 19, 2017 9:03 pm
It'll get rid of the remaining ASF on currently crafted banded greensteel; the old bug was adjusted out a while ago. So there are currently three tiers of greensteel there's just a lot of the middle group (read: the worst armor of the lot):
Pre Nerf with 0% ASF
Immediately After Nerf with 10% ASF
After Fix with 5% ASF
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Maladus
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by Maladus » Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:41 pm
Yeah, I’m wearing the after fix variant that has 5% ASF so my reduction drops it to 0% allowing for full casting while wearing armor.
Last edited by
Maladus on Fri Dec 22, 2017 2:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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One Two Three Five
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by One Two Three Five » Fri Dec 22, 2017 12:50 am
Less a build question more a script? question, for yall doing -twohand spellswords: Does swapping out of -twohand automatically apply your spellsword ac, or what?
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Clerics are just socially acceptable warlocks.
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Griefmaker
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by Griefmaker » Fri Dec 22, 2017 2:45 pm
One Two Three Five wrote:Less a build question more a script? question, for yall doing -twohand spellswords: Does swapping out of -twohand automatically apply your spellsword ac, or what?
Yeah, I was playing around with this yesterday with my character and his dwarven war axe. Two-handing it, the shield AC disappears. Change back to "one-handed" and it magically reappears again.
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legionetrangere
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by legionetrangere » Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:18 am
Is this a viable build for a dwarf SS?
Bear in mind that my guys is already at lvl 6, and i'm quite happy by chosing luck of heroes. Luck is never too much. Please consider only from the 7th lvl forward
EDIT: Somewhere before lvl 6 i also took expertise, forgot to write it down
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Hunter548
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by Hunter548 » Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:40 am
I'm wondering why you're taking longsword focus, rather than battleaxe for the dwarf axe, but otherwise it's passable if you're insistent on going for Autostill 3. Taking a tumble dip might be helpful too.
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legionetrangere
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by legionetrangere » Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:43 am
Hunter548 wrote:I'm wondering why you're taking longsword focus, rather than battleaxe for the dwarf axe, but otherwise it's passable if you're insistent on going for Autostill 3. Taking a tumble dip might be helpful too.
IT's merely for RP reasons i chose the longsword, instead of the usual dwarven waraxe. Regarding Autostill III, what other feat could've take its place? And for a class tumble dip, bard maybe? but how can one squeeze it in a already squeezed build?
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Maladus
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by Maladus » Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:05 am
As a Strength based Spellsword, should I be gearing for Strength + Intelligence or Strength + Constitution?
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Terenfel
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by Terenfel » Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:02 am
you can get +5 str +5 int and +5 con, from items, then ESF trasmutation, + maxized bull str, endurence and fox'z cunning and your at +12 in all 3.
in lower levels i would go for str > con > int. (keeping int on a modifer thats equel to wizard level /2)