Arcane archers

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Gulddrengen
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Arcane archers

Post by Gulddrengen » Mon Jul 17, 2017 6:10 pm

I'm looking for an AA build, maybe containing ranger (would fit the RP concept) or rogue or both, anyone got some good suggestions?

Maybe a good sneak, preferably a good damage dealer and preferably with 11 AA levels for the +6 enchantment. Character is a half-elf.

Or would a non-sneak AA work better, say bard/fighter/AA, anyone got any experiences they would like to share?

Thank you for your time.
Last edited by Gulddrengen on Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Opustus
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Opustus » Mon Jul 17, 2017 6:47 pm

For the sneakysneak AA the solid build, I imagine, would be going Rogue at least 13 for Epic Dodge, at least one level of Ranger (archer path to nab two free feats!), and finally AA as much as you like. By starting Rogue, you can leave your WIS below 11 to retain your hit dice for purposes of Dispel instead of your measly Ranger caster level (I'll happily elaborate if needed). The optimal build might be Rogue8/Ranger2/AA10 pre-epic into Rogue13/Ranger3/AA14, though that can be easily changed.

Another concept I've been fiddling with is BardorWarlock8/SD13/AA9. It's prone to dispel, has less consistent damage, but gets the shadow summon, which might help your soloing significantly.
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Jagel
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Jagel » Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:09 pm

You need at least three lvls in any class you pick.

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Opustus
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Opustus » Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:12 pm

Oh duh, of course. Then it's Ranger4/Rogue17/AA9 or Ranger4/Rogue13/AA13.
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Rags
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Rags » Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:25 pm

It sounds like you're looking for a Ranger/Rogue/AA. In which case, I'd go 5/16/9. If I remember correctly, you should be able to grab Epic Dodge. You'll be relying a lot on Sneak Attacks for damage.

Additionally, some other builds to consider:
Bard 5/Monk 6/AA 19
Bard 4/Paladin 7/AA 19 | Bard 7/Paladin 4/ AA 19
Bard 5/Fighter 6/AA 19

You'll probably notice a common trend here; the more AA, the better, in general.

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Jagel
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Jagel » Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:26 pm

Might be interesting to do a ranger/shadow dancer/ arcane archer combo. The shadow guards while you pop arrows into critters' faces. Ranger 6/ SD 13/ AA 11 is a possible build for this.

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Baron Saturday
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Baron Saturday » Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:30 am

Jagel wrote:Might be interesting to do a ranger/shadow dancer/ arcane archer combo. The shadow guards while you pop arrows into critters' faces. Ranger 6/ SD 13/ AA 11 is a possible build for this.
Huh, has some nice stuff going for it. +6 arrows, level 23 Shadow w/ 73% conceal, 7d6 sneak attack as long as you keep your Shadow close. Absolutely get Epic Shadowlord and edodge, and weapon finesse so your Shadow has some offensive capability.

Big tradeoffs,though. No UMD and low discipline (max 16 ranks if cross-classed), so definitely not a PvP build, and if your Shadow goes down in PvE you're in trouble.
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Opustus
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Opustus » Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:05 pm

You can achieve the same with Bard or Warlock for two less AB, but netting UMD instead. With Ranger, you'd have to go Ranger7 to dump Discipline as it's not a class skill for either AA or SD.
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Sockss
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Sockss » Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:35 pm

Go for way more AA. Or you might as well be melee. (AB is what differentiates you)

The best current build in the arelith meta for AA is prolly bard/aa/(BG,Pala, Harper paragon).

With a moderate starting cha bonus and gear you get a lot of benefit. (Saves, divine might damage)

Ranger isn't great with an AA mix as you'll generally need to dip bard anyway for UMD, spellcraft and tumble.

Generally speaking stealthier/sneak attack aa's aren't great from a pure mechanical stand point. Even if you ignore true seeing, you're essentially removing the advantage of using a ranged weapon in order to get off a slightly higher damage for a couple of attacks. Something that a melee will do far better due to the increased Apr with dual welding and the way that flurries work.
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Astral » Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:21 pm

9 monk, 4 bard, 17 aa. The classic. Probably the only archer build worth playing given how difficult it already is to level archers up.

if you really want ranger for RP reasons, start with 6 ranger (archer path) so you can craft free arrows, and then you can just start the aa lvls and see how it goes. There's no right or wrong anymore after that point. third class rogue or bard.
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Jack Oat
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Jack Oat » Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:16 pm

Astral wrote:9 monk, 4 bard, 17 aa. The classic. Probably the only archer build worth playing given how difficult it already is to level archers up.

if you really want ranger for RP reasons, start with 6 ranger (archer path) so you can craft free arrows, and then you can just start the aa lvls and see how it goes. There's no right or wrong anymore after that point. third class rogue or bard.
The classic is 6/5/19 Mo/Ba/AA.
Other good AAs are 6/5/19 Paladin/Bard/AA and 10/4/16 AA/Bard/PM, though the latter is a bit of a meme build. The issue with AA and Rogue is that they're polar opposites; AA is designed to boost damage at range, so you don't NEED to get close. Rogue requires you to get close and, while e-dodge is nice, you won't have the AC to survive later attacks.

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Astral
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Astral » Tue Jul 18, 2017 5:38 pm

Jack Oat wrote:
Astral wrote:9 monk, 4 bard, 17 aa. The classic. Probably the only archer build worth playing given how difficult it already is to level archers up.

if you really want ranger for RP reasons, start with 6 ranger (archer path) so you can craft free arrows, and then you can just start the aa lvls and see how it goes. There's no right or wrong anymore after that point. third class rogue or bard.
The classic is 6/5/19 Mo/Ba/AA.
Other good AAs are 6/5/19 Paladin/Bard/AA and 10/4/16 AA/Bard/PM, though the latter is a bit of a meme build. The issue with AA and Rogue is that they're polar opposites; AA is designed to boost damage at range, so you don't NEED to get close. Rogue requires you to get close and, while e-dodge is nice, you won't have the AC to survive later attacks.

6 monk, 5 bard, 19 aa is a bit for an over kill. 9 monk lvls give 30% movement (essential for archers) and improved evasion. I wouldn't build a divine archer unless I've played archers for years and know how to kite in laggy conditions. Otherwise, I'd die more than I'd actually make the impact I want on the battle. I really recommend Monk as a base class for archers. My two scents. Also, Zen Archery is a thing.
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Kirito
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Kirito » Tue Jul 18, 2017 6:06 pm

It might not be "optimal" but it was fun when I played a 7 Ranger/ 4 Fighter/ 13 AA... the damage put out by 3 essence arrows was insane!

AC sucked a lot, by called shot meant nothing would reach me
Last edited by Kirito on Tue Jul 18, 2017 6:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Astral
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Astral » Tue Jul 18, 2017 6:29 pm

Kirito wrote: AC sucked a lot, by called shothe meant nothing would r3ach me
Except things with 70+ discipline and/or lesser restore pots. Just to point that out because Called Shot isn't without counters and you shouldn't build your archer around that.
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Kirito
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Kirito » Tue Jul 18, 2017 7:00 pm

Astral wrote:
Kirito wrote: AC sucked a lot, by called shot meant nothing would reach me
Except things with 70+ discipline and/or lesser restore pots. Just to point that out because Called Shot isn't without counters and you shouldn't build your archer around that.
Sorry, should have clarified, I was talking pve when saying nothing could reach. :)

Gulddrengen
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Gulddrengen » Tue Jul 18, 2017 8:33 pm

Been considering Rogue 16 Ranger 3 AA 11.

Astral
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Astral » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:20 pm

Gulddrengen wrote:Been considering Rogue 16 Ranger 3 AA 11.
just want to remind you that 6th lvl ranger (archer path) gets to make arrow bundles for free. Worth considering it in the build.
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Tiefling Tea Party » Tue Jul 18, 2017 11:14 pm

Gulddrengen wrote:Been considering Rogue 16 Ranger 3 AA 11.
Swap one rogue for one ranger at 30 so you can get Discpline and Epic Skill Focus: Discpline. I have this build wrote up if you want it. Keep in mind leveling archers is a god awful time.

Gulddrengen
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Gulddrengen » Wed Jul 19, 2017 12:04 am

Sure, would like to see it.

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High Primate
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Re: Arcane archers

Post by High Primate » Sun Jul 23, 2017 6:54 pm

6/5/19 Paladin/Bard/AA is probably the best on this list, capable of getting the most damage while also having excellent AB.
Some builds I've worked on (not recommended):
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"E-Dodge Brycer"

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Re: Arcane archers

Post by Astral » Sun Jul 23, 2017 9:23 pm

High Primate wrote:6/5/19 Paladin/Bard/AA is probably the best on this list, capable of getting the most damage while also having excellent AB.
On paper, my friend. In reality all archers without monk lvls die a lot for silly reasons. The movement speed is priceless. And if you go Zen Archery your spot check will potentially reach 80s and you will be VERY resilient against most forms of CC.
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