Raise dead/Ressurection penalties and healer's Lifeline

[Dalenger]

I know this may seem a bit belated seeing how old the raise dead/resurrection nerf was, but the new massive piety costs of casting these spells really puts a damper on the already niche lifeline ability that healers are supposed to have. Is there any way to rebalance the lifeline ability to make it useful? Perhaps eliminate the piety penalty unless the spell actually takes effect, or lengthen the effect of the lifeline to 1/2 turns per level?

[Cortex]

Reverting the nerfs to Raise Dead/Resurrection would be a good start.

[Gobbo Champion Inc]

The only way the nerfs have effected me personally is that I no longer help people who die/have died, who are not ic allies. With the exception of lower levels, I have not lacked the means to raise my own allies, or to give them scrolls or other consumables to raise my pc. Its not made death a bigger deal, if that was the intended effect.

[Tarkus the dog]

Reverting the nerfs to Raise Dead/Resurrection would be a good start.

[CosmicOrderV]

I've thoroughly enjoyed the altar-raise system, as opposed to purchasing scrolls. Tweaking might be cool, but it in a world where death is largely up to us give meaning to, it's nice to have some actual mechanical consequences. Even if that consequence is simply to portal out and go find the nearest altar.

If things were to change, I'd love to see it stay at a high price for non-clerics.

[Dalenger]

I don't mean to start a debate about if the change was a good one or not. But I hope we can all agree that with this change, healers are unproportionally effected as their lifeline ability, which was already niche, now is never worth the cost of the cast. Was lifeline ever worth using? Burning a res spell on the bet that your party member will die in the next minute as opposed to just preventing the death and the loss of all their buffs doesn't exactly seem worth it. Now, with a 50% piety cost, that means that if your friend dies 1 turn and a round later, you don't have the piety to cast res if you wanted to or not. Pretty shit deal.

[Cortex]

What mechanical consequenses, 500 exp and couple hours of stat debuffs? Those are pretty much inconsequential.

[Astral]

Death has no meaning. Its up to the player to decide how it influences the character's story or ends it. I used to be in favor of nerfing raise dead back before they were nerfed. Looking back, I think it was a bad call because death still has no meaning except a none-mechanical twist in the plot if anything. At this point I might as well be in favor of reverting those changes back.

[Sea Shanties]

Seems like removing the piety hit from healer clerics using lifeline would suddenly make it a very useful ability and give healers additional value. It could easily be justified as preventing death rather than raising someone from the dead.

[Yolrii]

What mechanical consequenses, 500 exp and couple hours of stat debuffs? Those are pretty much inconsequential.

If you're a caster, they're a huge deal.

If you're a dexer, chances are you cannot move.

The penalties are clearly weighted to disadvantage some parties more than others at present. Maybe a more hefty strength/dex penalty for certain classes?

[The GrumpyCat]

Apologise if by this post I am slightly derailing the topic - but here's food for throught reguarding Death and consequences.

With the exception of a Permadeath system, any consequences we give to death ICly will always be in our hands, it's up to us and our rp to reflect death however we want.

Any mechanical consequences we put down (again with the possible exception of permadeath) is not neccesarly a consequence for the character (though those who are good rpers may treat it so one hopes) but more a consequence for the player.

Harsher consequences may encourage behaviors in the player, and maybe in the character, that are more in turne with 'taking death seriously'. But they will not enforce it.

[Cortex]

What mechanical consequenses, 500 exp and couple hours of stat debuffs? Those are pretty much inconsequential.

If you're a caster, they're a huge deal.

If you're a dexer, chances are you cannot move.

The penalties are clearly weighted to disadvantage some parties more than others at present. Maybe a more hefty strength/dex penalty for certain classes?

I died a few times on a character with 8 DEX, and stats are not put below the 8 mark, so I was never encumbered by death penalties. Casters have it the easiest because they can still likely summon their best elemental, give it a few token buffs and go to whichever place is the safest for your level.

[Peppermint]

Yeah, these spells really ought not to cost piety for lifeline. Seems like an oversight.

[LIonGraphiK]

Raise dead/Resurrection is what makes a cleric special. If everyone can just raise people, what's the point? lol. I personally like that it costs a lot of piety. It stops people from abusing it. Let Clerics have something that makes them special, yesh?

[Sea Shanties]

Raise dead/Resurrection is what makes a cleric special. If everyone can just raise people, what's the point? lol. I personally like that it costs a lot of piety. It stops people from abusing it. Let Clerics have something that makes them special, yesh?

Not really, since the piety makes it so clerics would rather haul you to an altar instead of taking a 25/50% hit.

Anyway this topic is about the healer "Lifeline" ability which really shouldn't have a piety hit or at least not such a large one so maybe a discussion of the death system and general raising should be elsewhere. Hate for the OP's point to be lost.

[Taerl]

So funny thing. I just found out about this pity hit when raising someone. Missed it some how but then I don't raise with scrolls unless in a bad place. So was in mourn, me and one other. Just as we get started inside my friend gets killed, I use my last scroll, a rez scroll. We move on and eventually get to the last area before the big boss. We get hammered big time, friend dies, I get a good save manage to rebuff kill everything and use a raise dead on them they gave me after raising them earlier. Now debating the big boss I check my piety due to my god save and I send my friend a tell..... Wtf why is my piety so low it was 100% coming into mourn. They told me about the change that appearantly happened a good time back and we laugh that I never knew. I think it's cool, I like it for those having to use scrolls. I also thing clerics in general should not suffer a hit at all as that what clerics do. Said my peace, or is it piece?!?!?! Oh and we portaled out in the lever room to final boss.