Should we consider recanonizing how death works

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MineTurtle
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Re: Should we consider recanonizing how death works

Post by MineTurtle » Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:21 pm

I was surprised recently in Cordor when a supposed Warlock was killed. The conversation ran something like, X killed Y, and Y is _actually_ dead!

Because the default assumption in Arelith, for our characters, is that if Y is murdered, they'll probably be back five minutes later and it's not that bothersome, and it's something properly special when someones murdered and doesn't come back five minutes later. [But you do still vaguely wonder if they'll be back by Saturday.]

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Cybernet21
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Re: Should we consider recanonizing how death works

Post by Cybernet21 » Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:29 pm

That sounds like mixing what the player knows and what the character knows
My family were all knights,but none protected those who cannot fight for themselves.They all cared about their noble status more than anything else.I would be a true knight,i would train on the ways of the paladin -Arcavius Ryde

Brandon Steel
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Re: Should we consider recanonizing how death works

Post by Brandon Steel » Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:42 pm

I mean it’s mixing yeah, but it’s not really something you can help. It’s hard to really get invested in any sort of death when the persons coming back in 5 minutes lol. Also kind of makes killing anyone awkward because they’re just going to come back with full knowledge of any of the events that happened.

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Atlantahammy
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Re: Should we consider recanonizing how death works

Post by Atlantahammy » Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:47 pm

Cybernet21 wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:23 pm
Oh and avoid going with "x murdered me" type of RP,if something can correct that is simply making the "x killed me" forbidden and reportable since it's very poor RP.
Wasn't that the reason death was changed to how it is now? I don't recall where I heard it, but I was told people actually where abusing that greatly to get away with killing who ever they wanted? Just basically not having to deal with the coincidences for their actions.

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Cybernet21
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Re: Should we consider recanonizing how death works

Post by Cybernet21 » Fri Oct 19, 2018 12:58 am

Atlantahammy wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:47 pm
Cybernet21 wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:23 pm
Oh and avoid going with "x murdered me" type of RP,if something can correct that is simply making the "x killed me" forbidden and reportable since it's very poor RP.
Wasn't that the reason death was changed to how it is now? I don't recall where I heard it, but I was told people actually where abusing that greatly to get away with killing who ever they wanted? Just basically not having to deal with the coincidences for their actions.
I have no idea,but that is a bummer if true,in any way it's an example of how there will never be a 100% effective solution to stuff like this
My family were all knights,but none protected those who cannot fight for themselves.They all cared about their noble status more than anything else.I would be a true knight,i would train on the ways of the paladin -Arcavius Ryde

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Atlantahammy
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Re: Should we consider recanonizing how death works

Post by Atlantahammy » Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:07 am

Cybernet21 wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 12:58 am
Atlantahammy wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:47 pm
Cybernet21 wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:23 pm
Oh and avoid going with "x murdered me" type of RP,if something can correct that is simply making the "x killed me" forbidden and reportable since it's very poor RP.
Wasn't that the reason death was changed to how it is now? I don't recall where I heard it, but I was told people actually where abusing that greatly to get away with killing who ever they wanted? Just basically not having to deal with the coincidences for their actions.
I have no idea,but that is a bummer if true,in any way it's an example of how there will never be a 100% effective solution to stuff like this
Yeah it was along the lines of people just pvping a person and them being able to do nothing about it, and that got so common it was part why it was relaxed.

Yeaah your right, nothing can be really be 100% exploit or abuse free, It's mostly just about making sure it works and can't be abused as much.

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Hunter548
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Re: Should we consider recanonizing how death works

Post by Hunter548 » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:06 am

Atlantahammy wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:47 pm
Cybernet21 wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:23 pm
Oh and avoid going with "x murdered me" type of RP,if something can correct that is simply making the "x killed me" forbidden and reportable since it's very poor RP.
Wasn't that the reason death was changed to how it is now? I don't recall where I heard it, but I was told people actually where abusing that greatly to get away with killing who ever they wanted? Just basically not having to deal with the coincidences for their actions.
The reasoning for the ruling was never announced publically - though I sincerely doubt this was it.
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-XXX-
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Re: Should we consider recanonizing how death works

Post by -XXX- » Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:07 pm

When a character manages to prevail in a PvP encounter in such manner that the only way to tie them to the incident is for their victim to return from the dead and point at them, then I'd say that it'd be reasonable to conclude that such character played their cards right and deserves to get away with it.

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Durvayas
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Re: Should we consider recanonizing how death works

Post by Durvayas » Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:02 pm

The Kriv wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:34 pm
Given the obviously mixed opinions on death, how to treat it IC as well as the importance of it... would it be worthwhile to CHANGE the # of negative HP's required to SEND your character to the death plane?

the -10 HP rule, has come to us from standard table-top D&D rules. And EVERYONE who has played even ONE session of traditional table-top D&D combat with more than 2 actual players knows that dropping to the negatives doesn't push you to DEAD-DEAD in nine (9) or less ticks of a 6-second "round", because D&D is a turn-based game. So your party members have lots and lots of time to both recognize their party member has dropped, and formulate a plan to move to and stabilize them to save them from DEATH... a luxury we in the video-game version of D&D are not presently afforded.

But we are playing a live-action, real-time game... why then MUST we beholden to this very clear and obvious TURN-BASED mechanic? Is it REALLY necessary?

Would it be worth extending that number from -10 to -100? it would give a lot more leeway in that death-blow to keep you from being drop-kicked to Kelvemoor's wall.

once combat ceases, the 'dying' stabilization roll could shift from Turns (6 seconds) to Rounds (60 seconds).

And if you decided you wanted to -not- wait for the timer to tick out... say, your entire party is down, and instead of lying there waiting for your death to slowly consume your points... a console command could be written up with a creative name like:
-release_spirit .... or ... -gointothelight
so that when you activate this console command, it calls up your HP total, and if it returns true for < 0 you immediately die and go to the death plane ... and things proceed as normal.


I'm a fan of this post. Its almost impossible to have any meaningful "I'm bleeding to death" type (could also be dying of plague, magic illness, old age, etc etc etc) RP without running into the issue that when you're put into the negatives the vast majority of the time you're either going to die instantly, or you're going to have less than 5HP, so you have all of 30 seconds to put out an emote before death.

Aside from it mechanically sucking, this was a big reason why people didn't do Mark Of Destiny PCs. It was a crapshoot as to if you'd be able to have an exit scene at all.

This also makes it difficult to actually have a PC permadie with satisfying RP, and the reason most PCs I've seen rolled decide to just sail into the sunset or kill themselves.
Plays: Durvayas(deleted), Marco(deleted), Hounynrae(NPC), Sinithra Auvry'ndal(rolled), Rauvlin Barrith(Active), Madeline Clavelle(Shelved)

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