Fixture Destruction Update

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azrael_athing
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by azrael_athing » Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:36 pm

Daedin wrote: The new system is, in fact, better. The way descriptions and names are saved? Ingenious and a life saver.
I actually think the Descriptions of the objects are not saved currently?

WinkinBlinkin
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by WinkinBlinkin » Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:44 pm

Random thought: what if it required crafting points to destroy things?

Rwby
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Rwby » Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:43 pm

WinkinBlinkin wrote:Random thought: what if it required crafting points to destroy things?
I'd help repair your helmet, but I've just finished tearing up all those cushions, and frankly, I'm worn right through.

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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Dunshine » Fri Apr 07, 2017 10:43 am

A little fellow wrote:Wake up, step outside, see half of the fixtures outside of Brogendenstein are now remains, some of which destroyed completely.

This update was a nice idea, I see the reasoning behind it. But it has encouraged griefing on a large scale and it is just awful.

Fixtures aren't just a case of making something and putting it down. You need think of names names and descriptions, gather resources, contact tailors, stonemasons, carpenters whoever else and then place the things. After seeing at least 10 fixtures destroyed over the course of a day, why the hell would I consider fixing them? It's a losing battle, and seeing as we have no way of knowing who did it, it's a battle we wont win.
These fixtures were destroyed by lightning from the weather system. So far all claims of griefing happening due to this rule change, turned out to have nothing to do with that.

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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Rwby » Fri Apr 07, 2017 10:49 am

And let me add, that before fixtures destroyed by lighting from the Weather system would have just vanished. Now they can be rebuilt, easier, and with descriptions intact.

I got to trash some fixtures earlier, an evil cleric walked past a shrine of a deity she was opposed to and I thought, 'Oh! I can smash this, leave clues and have concequences!' Where as before I would have been like... I could just remove this, but I doubt the player would appreciate this much. I thought about trashing the lot with a fireball, [I could of!] but instead settled on destroying a single fixture, leaving a pile of rubble and a cryptic clue.

I know it generated RP for others later, and I was pleased to pass it again on another character and see it restored to its former glory.

We've been given amazing new tools to create conflict, without nearly as much ooc hurt as before. Embrace them guys, seriously.

Hawker
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Hawker » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:48 am

Dunshine wrote: These fixtures were destroyed by lightning from the weather system. So far all claims of griefing happening due to this rule change, turned out to have nothing to do with that.
Are you completely sure about that? Investigating the remains reported an unarmored female destroying them with bludgeoning damage. If they really were destroyed by a natural lightning strike then that information that was provided IC to a character with appropriate skills and *blank* is a problem.

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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Dunshine » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:51 am

Yup, I'm completely sure. Also just pushed a fix for the investigating info for this, so that lightning strike is listed as the reason for destruction, which has a DC of 0, so everyone can see that.

Rwby
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Rwby » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:59 am

Hawker wrote:
Dunshine wrote: These fixtures were destroyed by lightning from the weather system. So far all claims of griefing happening due to this rule change, turned out to have nothing to do with that.
Are you completely sure about that? Investigating the remains reported an unarmored female destroying them with bludgeoning damage. If they really were destroyed by a natural lightning strike then that information that was provided IC to a character with appropriate skills and *blank* is a problem.

Clearly, the unarmoured female was Auril.

Hawker
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Hawker » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:28 pm

Dunshine wrote:Yup, I'm completely sure. Also just pushed a fix for the investigating info for this, so that lightning strike is listed as the reason for destruction, which has a DC of 0, so everyone can see that.
Thank you for clearing that up, we should probably call off the witch hunt for the woman that had the nerve to destroy dwarven property .... or not.

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A little fellow
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by A little fellow » Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:21 pm

Image

Image

Can I just say, this still isn't fun, nor has it created RP.

EDIT: And it has happened more and more often since the update.
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Arithel 98
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Arithel 98 » Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:35 pm

A little fellow wrote:Image

Image

Can I just say, this still isn't fun, nor has it created RP.

EDIT: And it has happened more and more often since the update.
Seconded and thirded

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Sabines
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Sabines » Sun Apr 23, 2017 1:46 pm

Dunshine wrote:I've been investigating these claims of people abusing the new rules by smashing up many fixtures, but this turned out to be housecleaning by DMs instead.
What does house-cleaning entail? What fixtures qualify for house-cleaning?
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Rwby
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Rwby » Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:49 pm

This feels like the same irritation people had before when their fixtures got destroyed, only now you notice because of helpful, rebuildable remains, and you might get some clues as to who did it. Seriously guys, this is an improvement.

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A little fellow
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by A little fellow » Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:01 pm

Rwby wrote:This feels like the same irritation people had before when their fixtures got destroyed, only now you notice because of helpful, rebuildable remains, and you might get some clues as to who did it. Seriously guys, this is an improvement.
It would definitely be an improvement if people were a bit more respectful of fixtures in the first place. They're not, so they walk around trying to tick off their one fixture bash per day. It's gone from noticing the odd fixture missing every now and then to having to repair the same fixtures every day or two. As I say, it's not fun, it's actually incredibly annoying ... And it does not create RP, unless my character drops everything he's doing to declare a purge on any female human who uses a slashing weapon.

All it does it give griefers the option to say "but you can just repair it, so it's not that bad". Whereas before they knew that attacking a fixture was to destroy it outright, which means they did it faaaar less often.
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Sab1
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Sab1 » Mon Apr 24, 2017 12:04 am

Walk from Gnoll caves to Minmir manor, the road it littered with fixture remains. Pretty sure every torch bracket has been pummeled.

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A little fellow
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by A little fellow » Mon Apr 24, 2017 9:33 am

Sab1 wrote:Walk from Gnoll caves to Minmir manor, the road it littered with fixture remains. Pretty sure every torch bracket has been pummeled.
Gotta love that sweet sweet RP.
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by CragOrion » Mon Apr 24, 2017 10:22 am

Or you know, it could be all those bandits and gnolls roaming the lands sticking it to the man...or mages fighting for their lives and stuff gets broken in the process. When you put fixtures down in hostile areas, you shouldn't get surprised when they get destroyed

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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Trunx » Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:12 am

Sab1 wrote:Walk from Gnoll caves to Minmir manor, the road it littered with fixture remains. Pretty sure every torch bracket has been pummeled.
Why would you even put random fixtures in hostile areas? Them getting destroyed sounds IC.

Daedin

Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Daedin » Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:35 am

Except..a lot of these fixtures that little fellow is speaking of had been there for several rl months, a few even rl years, without so much as a scratch.

Now they get bashed down on a daily basis for no other reason other than "Because I can and it isn't against the rules."

There is no roleplay nor interaction before or after the deed. Just the act of logging in and finding out some of your work and effort has been undone by some random,faceless and bored passerby.

Granted, and as I said before, I really like the way the new system works, since descriptions are saved and restored upon repair.

The issue seems to be that the looser rules around fixture destruction end up being more of a chore for the "victim" than any actual fun mechanic or rp.

azrael_athing
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by azrael_athing » Mon Apr 24, 2017 1:03 pm

Trunx wrote:
Sab1 wrote:Walk from Gnoll caves to Minmir manor, the road it littered with fixture remains. Pretty sure every torch bracket has been pummeled.
Why would you even put random fixtures in hostile areas? Them getting destroyed sounds IC.
Seconded

IMO there is very many Fixtures out there that are not longer in use, and there is actualy no rights for these things, created by old characters nearly forgotten to be there. As it limits the new characters to build their own monuments. And temples, and whatever it is we build with all our fixtures.

When the RP is gone, so should the fixtures to leave space for the younger generation of Characters.

Not saying this sanctions destroying your stuff, but there has been a fixturecluttering on the servers. I presume it is still there.
Last edited by azrael_athing on Mon Apr 24, 2017 1:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Morderon
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by Morderon » Mon Apr 24, 2017 1:07 pm

The set DC of 25 is crazy when most fixtures don't require that much. Though it's nice for say.. bushes and anything with history. But they shouldn't require the cp they have anymore either.

Someone can destroy an unlimited amount of fixtures but an individual can only repair 2 of them a day; barring they don't roll a 1 and are invested in the trade.

But for many fixtures it would just be better to have the description saved and recreate them from scratch. Which you could had done anyways pre-update.

Note: I've not seen many fixtures destroyed personally outside of non-hostile areas. Some. Not many.

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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by The Kriv » Mon Apr 24, 2017 2:05 pm

clarification:

in the images above by That Little Guy... the lower image is in Brog, just inside the main door. I carried those remains down from the mountain pass leading to the Outpost up just below the Hot Springs.

They were two torch brackets and the sign naming the small pass Goran's Scar.

They were left next to the message board there, with an accompanying note on the message board identifying the remains as being from the mountain, suggesting that repairs could now be made from a place where the resources to fix them were available, rather than some path far away. -not having the skill or the means to make repairs, my char still wished to see them repaired and thought bringing them to Brog would help get them repaired and replaced more efficiently.

so we can't say they didn't generate -any- RP, since my char did RP carrying them back to hand them off to a potential team of craftsman to do the maintenance.

This clarification is to show that those three sets of remains were -not- fixture bashed in Brog, but actually came from a wilderness area away from any settlement.

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The GrumpyCat
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by The GrumpyCat » Mon Apr 24, 2017 2:50 pm

It's gone from noticing the odd fixture missing every now and then to having to repair the same fixtures every day or two.
As a point, if you are getting a fixture bashed every. Single. Day., then please let us know and we'll look into it. It may not be going against the letter of the law, but it certainly is against the spirit.
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If Valor Were Inches
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by If Valor Were Inches » Mon Apr 24, 2017 2:51 pm

Honestly I want it easier to be caught. If I was destroying fixtures I'd want to be found out, or at least, there be enough clues to suggest. It's not as fun to be an antagonist if you're never caught or noticed and get away with everything. It's why I'm sometimes pretty blatant and obvious instead of covert.

I'm not sure what clues they leave now, but from the combination of -track and investigating the destruction or nearby NPCs, I'd like for investigators to figure out:

Weapon used
Elemental Damage if applicable
Race/Gender/Armor from tracks (I wish the race was specific, and not the general race).
How long ago this happened.

What gives what could be configured by lore and such, but it would contribute more RP if more details were provided.

DMTemplate
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Re: Fixture Destruction Update

Post by DMTemplate » Mon Apr 24, 2017 3:24 pm

DM GrumpyCat wrote:
It's gone from noticing the odd fixture missing every now and then to having to repair the same fixtures every day or two.
As a point, if you are getting a fixture bashed every. Single. Day., then please let us know and we'll look into it. It may not be going against the letter of the law, but it certainly is against the spirit.
I would like to clarify that such behavior could easily be against the rules. Namely rule #4: Be Nice.

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