Runic property on procedural loot

[Shadofury]

Roland Asen stumbles across a fantastic piece of loot, reads the description, and just starts screaming at the top of his lungs.

now that I would pay to see

[Hatsune Miku]

I can only imagine the penalty for an item that is more or less maxed out (5%) but has a runic property that some character out there wants enchanted, and they've had to search high and low for that particular race of enchanter with that specific focus of enchantment. What a pain.

I will never, ever understand why creating a scroll, wand or failing an enchantment negatively impacts on a character's tangible experience in their profession. Well, "It needs a risk". Then why not change it to actually gain experience but cost significantly more gold? Why not spell components, the life blood of every caster? Why not catalysts or certain ingots, with its intricate connections with other professions?

Thoroughly sick of the, "Oh, I'm just too drained / exhausted / feeling like death to enchant anymore because <Shar / insert Magic God here @ 100% Piety> is an RNG jerk. Selling enchantment services RP over for today, gotta go grind those stupid mushroom men again".
Why can't it be:

• "The purity of the gold ingot was absolute trash and broke down, but thank Shar, I managed to save the item so I can play a certain roulette again!"
• "The catalyst is unstable! Get away from the basin!" Maximized fireball explodes at the basin and sets the kobold enchanter's tail on fire for some reason
• "Let me just add that fire resistance rune... OH N-" Everyone in a short radius of the basin gets sucked in and imprisoned with a hostile ancient fire elemental(s)
  • If it dies, the enchantment might still work!
• "You want saves against death magic? Oh boy... here we go." Roll against weird/wail occurring, can't be warded, might survive if you and whoever is close casts clarity or mind black / shadow shield in time.
• "Roland Asen is enchanting?" Something always goes horribly wrong.

Somebody make crafting magical goods and enchantment basins great again. Give these professions some chaos and hilarity that creates engaging RP instead of just outright punishing the enchanter into using the noose that is -delete_character.

[theCountofMonteCristo]

I will never, ever understand why creating a scroll, wand or failing an enchantment negatively impacts on a character's tangible experience in their profession. Well, "It needs a risk". Then why not change it to actually gain experience but cost significantly more gold? Why not spell components, the life blood of every caster? Why not catalysts or certain ingots, with its intricate connections with other professions?

Because if it was spell components, ingots, or whatever other item, then the price of scrolls just go up to compensate. And it becomes trading gold for more gold. With an exp cost, there will always be a price to pay for it.

Now, if creating a wand had a chance of failure, in which the gold to create it, and the wand was lost then yes, remove the exp cost. But as long as there is no chance of failure or an exp cost it will always just be trading gold for more gold.

This is why exp cost on enchanting ought to go. There is already a chance for failure which already results in a loss (loss of the item and the gold!). The Exp cost on enchanting is just rubbing salt in the wounds.

[Red Sunset]

Experience also limited the amount of powerful things on the server too. It's a lot easier to get gold than experience. If you remove experience cost unless the gold cost is increased you'll see an influx of powerful items. Some of you may want this. I do not.

I have an enchanter. While the experience cost is annoying I like that it limits things. These powerful items are rare, and so they -mean- something to get. My character does not just enchant for coin either. Someone has to be willing to role play more than that: ally with me, spy on someone, murder someone, etc. If experience cost is removed because a portion of our player base sees enchanting only as a way to churn out coin make money and equip their allies and friends, that's the way it goes, I suppose, but I wont be enchanting all the time just for gold, or because its easier. Its pretty boring to sit in front of the basin for a portion of my play time. Unless someone offers more than coin I'm not going to do it.

Right now enchanting items still has -value-. If enchanting is too easy and one person can churn out item after item the value decreases. I've seen enchanters get weary of the never ending order list and quit. I don't think its just because of the experience cost. Maybe experience matters for low level, but the low level ones aren't kicking out your 11% and 5% gear either.

[One Two Three Five]

It's harder to get gold now, I expect. Back when appraise was (more) of a (different) thing, I remember a good few characters that got 100+ thousand gold before level 10, several of them mine. Buying loot jewelry from people at just under half what some npcs would pay him, in the thousands of items, was the most tedious, funniest scam one of my characters ever played.

I expect the balance of powerful items to be different but not necessarily higher over time.

[Red Sunset]

Harder to get is relative. While 100k is a fair bit of gold, even half that is still a lot, especially if exp is removed. I can, if I am patient, make +1 stat +1 stat +2 skill +2 skill +2 skill +2 skill items for 20-35k cost on average. Removing experience cost wont change that much since you wont want to waste coin on the last 11% attempt anyway, but it WILL affect the amount of 5% things you see.

[One Two Three Five]

Sure, but most of my experience with epic enchanters are level 30s that can burn/renew the XP with little effort regardless. At which point the problem was still money. More attempts at 5% items will eat up more gold, no?

[Red Sunset]

Yes it will eat more gold, but that is not what I was discussing. I was discussing the availability of powerful items. And while you are largely correct about 30's, and I wont argue how rare they may or may not be, or how easy it may be to get experience I will point out that if exp is removed it wont be just level 30's doing it, which increases the potential for such items.

[Griefmaker]

I think all the changes done to enchanting recently have been absolutely brilliant.

While I would love a more detailed system with rare components and the like, that would take a pile of work. But all that has been done has been a great and necessary change.

[Irongron]

I think all the changes done to enchanting recently have been absolutely brilliant.

While I would love a more detailed system with rare components and the like, that would take a pile of work. But all that has been done has been a great and necessary change.

It simply wasn't possible to approach the economy of Arelith without looking closely at loot and enchanting. I've been wishing a 'runic' approach for some time, and Midnight's update is an excellent starting off point. We're seeing loot and enchantment beginning to compliment each other, and I hope in time we'll see crafting brought into the fold too.

I'm really excited by the prospect of finding and some good runic treasures. Having Dwarven and Elven runes being the predominant form I also find very fitting to FR Lore, and the nature of the two races, and I think both Brogendenstein and Myon would benefit from this greater level of interaction with the server as a whole.

More will come of this in time, but I'm really happy with where we are right now, and the direction that we're heading in.

[Hunter548]

Having Dwarven and Elven runes being the predominant form I also find very fitting to FR Lore, and the nature of the two races, and I think both Brogendenstein and Myon would benefit from this greater level of interaction with the server as a whole.

While it does fit for dwarves/elves to be good at it (Due to dwarven runecrafting and elven magical traditions), surely humans should also be predominant in runic items? There's a plethora of human magocracies who rival or surpass the elves and dwarves, and two extinct civilizations of humans who were indisputably the best mages in FR history.

That's not to mention Thayan enclaves, which get money and power for Thay via the creation of magical items akin to the runic ones, and have a long history on Arelith.

[Morderon]

I'm holding our for language-based runics! Draconic/abyssal/celestial/infernal/sylvan(animal) anyone that knows the necessary language and has enchantment foci can enchant according to their level.

[Hunter548]

I'm holding our for language-based runics! Draconic/abyssal/celestial/infernal/sylvan(animal) anyone that knows the necessary language and has enchantment foci can enchant according to their level.

This would be really cool too.

[Kuma]

Roland Asen stumbles across a fantastic piece of loot, reads the description, and just starts screaming at the top of his lungs.

thatd be assuming roland goes adventuring

how else is he getting cash these days

[gilescorey]

how else is he getting cash these days

brutal sexy elven fun times

[yellowcateyes]

I'm wary of the implication that the optimal races to pick if you want to make an enchanter are dwarf or elf. It type casts the artificer role into a narrow race selection, while selectively ignoring other FR tropes - the gnome inventor or the Thayan magical item peddler.

If settlements need more reason to interact with the outside world, that issue is likely better addressed by changing settlement mechanics (and certain restrictive portals) rather than race-gating features of the enchantment system.

[Morderon]

If it wasn't for the ambassador system making learning racial languages a bit to easy. I would favor just knowing elven(xanalress substitutes)/dwarven as enough. I would weight draconic and the planar tongues more heavily given their class based and not often used in communications; and elven at least is very common.


I don't see this impacting settlements all to much.. maybe Brogendenstein but that's only because dwarven enchanters are rare and often found inside the settlement. Elven enchanters are all over (as long as your not murdering them ); especially once you start counting half-elves (which should likely be included).

[Irongron]

There is a lot of FR lore surrounding Dethek, and the whole 'Runecaster' thing. It could be a lore requirement, or even spellcraft, rather than simply knowing a language.

Though this isn't something on all such loot. Many of the runes are 'Arcane' and can be improved by any enchanter.

I'm sure we'll see more content related to such runes in future.

[Morderon]

Should be spellcraft given it's lore that focuses on spells/magic. But then I don't know an enchanter that doesn't also have spellcraft so enchantment focuses often be enough alone to check for. Unless it's decided to give a small bonus based off spellcraft result on chance to runic enchant. Correctly racial toons should probably be provided a bonus beyond just knowing the language.


Edit: on the other side of that.. racial boons!

[Seven Sons of Sin]

If it wasn't for the ambassador system making learning racial languages a bit to easy. I would favor just knowing elven(xanalress substitutes)/dwarven as enough. I would weight draconic and the planar tongues more heavily given their class based and not often used in communications; and elven at least is very common.


I don't see this impacting settlements all to much.. maybe Brogendenstein but that's only because dwarven enchanters are rare and often found inside the settlement. Elven enchanters are all over (as long as your not murdering them ); especially once you start counting half-elves (which should likely be included).

Ambassador system?

[Morderon]

NPC language tutor system.

Now it's a slow process and I don't mind it overly as there's other ways to not be heard/understood.

But if the language becomes tied to another system I don't much like that you can potentially bypass learning it from PCs.