Less Common Weapons

[Manabi]

So, how bad are the not-so-popular weapons of NWN as compared with the weapons we see all the time?

Is there a painfully obvious difference between a great great sword and a trident?
A whip from a scimitar? Or are these differences quite subtle?

There are so many weapons and we rarely get variety. I would hate if the lack of variety is because. . . Let's say only a few points of damage done in a battle.

[What_Evil_Lurks]

1) There is a big difference.

2) The difference is obvious.

3) You are welcome to make a martial character that specializes in a less optimal weapon if you wish. Anyone is welcome to make any character who uses any weapon they wish. *Shrugs*

[The Rambling Midget]

There isn't a huge difference between the best and the worst, but there's still a big enough difference that one's worth using over the other.

The Sickle is a good example. It does 1d6 (x2), whereas the Shortsword does 1d6 (19-20 x2), so the only reason to pick the Sickle is for RP, or because you don't have the necessary weapon proficiency.

Both the Spear and the Trident are large weapons, and both deal 1d8 damage, but the Spear has a x3 multiplier while the Trident only has x2. On top of that, the Trident requires Martial proficiency, but the Spear only requires Simple. That's a no brainer.

What you'll often see are characters who carry around cool weapons like whips and tridents for RP purposes, but use better weapons in combat, because NWN is a game of numbers, and using the second best is shooting yourself in the foot.

[Manabi]

Ah, that makes me incredibly sad. I wish that crafted weapons were sort of. . . equal to some extent.

[Seven Sons of Sin]

Top tier weapons of Arelith are typically the rapier and the scimitar. Unfortunately, power revolves greatly around critical hit chance mathematics. And shield AC typically outmatched 2handed damage.

It's the nature of a persistent roleplaying game. You want a character that's persistently good, not really good in circumstance Y or for duration X.

[Morderon]

If it wasn't for crit range/multiplier weapons would be much more on equal terms given most of your damage is going to come from item bonuses/strength/sneak attacks/spell buffs/favored enemies/feats.

I can think of a situation for most any weapon where it could be the best available for a class and/or race combination. Except pretty much light hammer. Light hammer just sucks. Double sided weapons also tend to suck due to requiring 15 dex, yet requiring strength for AB and not having the flexibitlity of a one-handed weapon where you could always choose to use a shield instead of an off-hand weapon. And have to remember that whip is basically a free disarm for those who spent into exotic. If you care more about disarm then the rest of the exotic weapons it's better to just get (improved) disarm.

[msterswrdsmn]

The difference is most profound if you're playing a STR based character. The difference is somewhat less profound if you're playing a rogue or assassin, or are dealing damage through means that don't rely on the weapon itself for damage (divine might, enchant arrow, etc).

Whips aren't very useful for disarm, sadly; they're small weapons, which means that your going to take a penalty against anything that isn't a shuriken, dagger, dart, or khukuri. Improved disarm is far more useful; you get a +4 attack bonus for every size catagory difference, coming out to +12 AB when using a large weapon against a tiny weapon. Thats more than all the non-AA AB feats put together.

But yeah. Most people use rapiers, scimitars and greatswords due to their higher crit range (greatswords are the only 2 handed weapon with 19/20 crits). Weapons with higher crit multipliers have smaller attack ranges, and are almost exclusively 2 handed. Which means loosing your shield AC.

The only exception to this that I can think of is crossbows; crossbows get a 19-20/x2 crit modifier, but require rapid reload to use effectively. Even then, most people prefer rapid shot with bows to crossbows.

You can still use weapons that AREN'T great and be successful. The spear version of Mifune was actually easier to handle than his prior incarnations. Some weapons require more salvaging than others. Shuriken, for example, are the worst weapons in the game in terms of damage. They deal 1d3 damage, but they cannot get bonuses from a characters STR modified (other thrown weapons do) and have a 20/x2 crit modifier. They're only viable with a low STR sneak based character, and even then, there are better options.

[SwampFoot]

Now I'm considering a whip wielding WM that uses shuriken for ranged attacks. A Halfling. Rogue. With trap laying skills.

[Faye]

If you go with Fighter and enchant that whip, it's viable. I had a character with 10 fighter levels and a 1D4 fire essence on her whip, and was doing a fair output of damage unbuffed!

Absolutely want to make a whip weaponsmaster one day. ONE DAY.

[Urch]

(greatswords are the only 2 handed weapon with 19/20 crits).

Heavy flails are two handed weapons that also have a crit range of 19/20 x2. In case anyone was interested using a bludgeoning version of a greatsword.


Whip weaponmasters. Man this needs to be a thing. Imagine a whole party of whip wielding warriors, who open their attacks with a volley of shurikens.

[Rystefn]

Layla's killed people with her whip. It's not ideal, but it works. Backed with actual feats and WM stuff, it would come out scary.

[SwampFoot]

Pure rogue WM didn't pan out. Feat starved and I completely forgot shield proficiency. AC was laughable. I also chose not to use any wands or scrolls for the test. Easily attainable equipment only. Fighter/WM/Rogue would have worked much better. I've had str based builds with better AC.


Edit: On a side note, whover runs the PGCC should add the whips that are available and the craftable shurikens, darts and throwing axes.

[msterswrdsmn]

If you're trying to make a whip-centeric build...

Drop Weaponmaster. Especially if you're making a dex build.

Weaponmasters are really only good for increasing crit rates at the cost of some insane feat requirements. Whips have such low damage that there really isn't much gained from raising the crit rate (sneak attack damage is completely unaffected by crits). Unless you have an insanely high STR score, you're going to get even less out of whip crits.

Something like a smiter bard/paladin with divine might or fighter/rogue would work. Not weaponmaster.

[Razmo_de]

Now I'm considering a whip wielding WM that uses shuriken for ranged attacks. A Halfling. Rogue. With trap laying skills.

Well, that is where the problem becomes really obvious. You need exotic proficiency for the whip, which will be a problem for a rogue. Your first possible WM level will be 14, after spending all feats (including rogue) for the prereqs.
Your crit range will be about as good as that of a non-WM scimitar/scythe user, and crits don't affect sneak attacks. Your WM levels are basically pointless.
Your shurikens will still not deal damage if you are outside sneak range.

All in all, whip is not good for WM.

If I'd take a build to go with whip WM, take a whip-WM paladin or cleric. Use the damage increase of your spells/CHA to whip 'em good.