How come powerbuilds got so much leverage in server?

[MojoJoe]

Sorry, I'm a little new here, but I've noticed the constant amount of powerbuilding individuals going around flaunting their strength and crushing others representing a certain won't mention town, and some of them's RP leaves much to be desired.

In any case, its frustrating see this constant one sided oppression that cannot be defeated because certain individuals in question are exceptionally good in PVP with well built characters.

Is Good RP + world changing events synonymous with really strong PVP skills?

[Rwby]

Not all the time, but very often.

Neverwinter nights is unfortunately a game, and people that play that game well, do better.

[Dr_Hazard89]

Yeah. It's sad.

[Wytchee]

Sadly, recent weeks have seen a very large increase in minimal-RP PvP encounters. While they're not technically breaking the rules, it's not really fostering RP when you go around smashing lowbies with very little interaction beforehand and making other players feel legitimately anxious for playing here. We have had good RP threads abandoned simply because we were too OOC worried about heading anywhere for fear of being stomped by one PvP-happy faction.

There seems to be some sort of raid/PvP party every night I'm on, and while I originally had IC reasons for avoiding that specific conflict I am finding my reasoning more and more OOC as this conflict draws out. I just don't want to play if simply going out to collect sand and coal runs the risk of me running into an enemy warband who will smash my character despite her wanting to remain neutral in all this. Yes, conflict is the beating heart of a persistent world; but constant PvP for the sake of PvP does not foster roleplay. Maybe there is RP amidst all this fog of war, maybe I'm just not part of it, but I honestly just don't see it occurring.

I understand there's an IC war going on but many of the players on "team good" have taken a break simply because the PvP seems very one-sided. Sadly there's not much we can do about it except keep note (maybe screenshots) of PvP encounters and forward them to the DMs in cases where we think there wasn't sufficient roleplay beforehand.

[gilescorey]

i'm sad =(

[Xerah]

The goal should be the best story. There are other games that are far better at determining skill between players than NWN.

I wonder if anyone on Arelith would ever even consider losing on purpose in a PVP fight. I feel like few would.

I have in the past (and will again no doubt) if I think that the loss result will provide a better story. Sure, sometimes it's great to get the W, but more often than not, you get the best character development from roleplaying through a loss as winning tends to maintain the status quo.

One nice thing I've found is that when you take that first step others are more than willing to do the same in return. When there is no permadeath, PVP cycles don't seem to accomplish much.

[JediMindTrix]

but constant PvP for the sake of PvP does not foster roleplay.

It can, if you let it.

[kittenblackfriends]

The first day I was back on the server, a weaponmaster walked up to me as I was on my way to a low level area and just smashed me into the ground with minimal RP.

The interaction was reported and documented.

[Irongron]

I think this is heightened by a gradual shift towards neutrality in DM policy since Arelith was first founnded.

In those early days anyone attempting to 'wage war' upon a settlement, especially a city, would have been cut down rather quickly by an overpowering force of NPCs, and entirely obliterating settlements/guildhouses was entirely on the table from the Dev side (See Stonehold).

In the current climate DMs generally avoid this, for the fear of 'taking sides'.

Ultimately though, and irrespective of RP quality, I believe we should probably see far greater consequences for this avenue of play.

[Wytchee]

but constant PvP for the sake of PvP does not foster roleplay.

It can, if you let it.

Nah. If I'm suffering anxiety for playing a game, I'm going to play a different game.

I see no problem with PvP. PvP (even exhaustive PvP) can and does foster roleplay. But I do see a problem with the pervasive "I win" mentality that leads to a state of PvP for PvP's sake.

[Irongron]

The first day I was back on the server, a weaponmaster walked up to me as I was on my way to a low level area and just smashed me into the ground with minimal RP.

This is kind of amusing, as on MY first day, over a decade ago, I too was murdered, twice, in the first few hours of play. Thankfully I soon learned that this was not an accurate reflection of the server, though at the time it left a rather bad impression!

[cptcuddlepants]

but constant PvP for the sake of PvP does not foster roleplay.

It can, if you let it.

Maybe for the people who are starting the constant PVP, but it's not very fun or enjoyable for the ones on the receiving end. :\

[JediMindTrix]

Maybe for the people who are starting the constant PVP, but it's not very fun or enjoyable for the ones on the receiving end. :\

Take the time to learn how and seize a little agency. I can reduce pretty much every complaint about PvP down to the unwillingness to invest the time (which is of variable value) required to learn how.

[Ramza]

In those early days anyone attempting to 'wage war' upon a settlement, especially a city, would have been cut down rather quickly by an overpowering force of NPCs.

For example look to suddenly level 17 NPCs getting 100s in all stats, along with other ridiculousness.

[Wytchee]

Maybe for the people who are starting the constant PVP, but it's not very fun or enjoyable for the ones on the receiving end. :\

Take the time to learn how and seize a little agency. I can reduce pretty much every complaint about PvP down to the unwillingness to invest the time (which is of variable value) required to learn how.

Really? Your response to our concerns is "git gud scrub"?

[Aftond]

if you quake in terror and comply with the big bad guy, I've found that your odds of survival increase by much! Act like a proud person who ain't afraid of anything and of course you will be tested.

[Xerah]

Maybe for the people who are starting the constant PVP, but it's not very fun or enjoyable for the ones on the receiving end. :\

Take the time to learn how and seize a little agency. I can reduce pretty much every complaint about PvP down to the unwillingness to invest the time (which is of variable value) required to learn how.

You could also consider what's good for the story instead.

[DarkDreamer]

I will say that there are times this war does get a fair bit out of hand and is leaving some very bad tastes in peoples mouths, BUT that said, there IS a lot of willingness to rp and such from the winning side too if people are willing to allow it. Being it prisoner RP or otherwise.

[JediMindTrix]

You could also consider what's good for the story instead.

Yea, I'm never going to buy into that somehow being mutually exclusive.

Really? Your response to our concerns is "git gud scrub"?

The message beyond your colorful twisting of my words is: invest the time to learn a new skill and feel far less anxiety about your character's agency.

[cptcuddlepants]

Maybe for the people who are starting the constant PVP, but it's not very fun or enjoyable for the ones on the receiving end. :\

Take the time to learn how and seize a little agency. I can reduce pretty much every complaint about PvP down to the unwillingness to invest the time (which is of variable value) required to learn how.

Okay, I'll bite.

I do not enjoy constant PVP because I dislike the idea of disrupting and derailing other people's playtime to the point where they don't want to log on anymore.

[Wildsong]

Maybe for the people who are starting the constant PVP, but it's not very fun or enjoyable for the ones on the receiving end. :\

Take the time to learn how and seize a little agency. I can reduce pretty much every complaint about PvP down to the unwillingness to invest the time (which is of variable value) required to learn how.

That's fair -- to a point.
Now, bare in mind, I've not yet been involved in the War madness because I know better than to try and mess with something I'm not prepared for
However, let's remember that this is a RP server. On the forums and home page, it is hailed and heralded as a dedicated RP server. Obviously, you play a bit and realize, hey pvp is important here to some degree. But to newcomers who are here for the RP, suddenly joining in and realizing just because their character started in Cordor makes them eligible for no-RP PvP from crazy powerbuilders is a - as Irongron put it - a bad first impression

There are a lot of newish / lower level players that aren't able to do much in this AT ALL, when it makes sense for their character's ICly to care about something like this and try to be involved. But when it's repeatedly met with powerbuilders who shut down all avenues or attempts at IC interaction and consequence, it sort of kills the whole idea / incentive to keep going.

In short; Yes learn to PvP if you want to be involved. But also remember that some folks are REALLY just here for the RP, and these sort of players make that hard - if not, impossible in some cases.

[Griefmaker]

PvP /can/ foster RP...but it is unfortunately rare.

An example of this is my "dark knight" Kaiden Vendigar who whilst a mighty level 5 ended up finding himself in a duel with Khabul just outside of Cordor after a great amount of RP. Kaiden was abused beautifully and subdued.

I knew OOCly my dude was dead, but that is how his RP is/was, so he went out like a champ. Khabul's player was great with how he RPed everything and the whole event went down wonderfully and actually led to further potential RP with the two (though sadly has not occurred yet), not to mention a significant change in my own guy's way of thinking and how he interacts with others.

So yes, PvP can actually foster roleplay.

But sadly, this is something that happens maybe five times out of a hundred.

[MojoJoe]

I don't want this thread to devolve into

"Suck up to the one threatening to kill you and you can survive"

And

"Get good if you don't wanna be pushed around in PVP"

ITs about actions and concequences.

IF one faction continues to be oppressive against another who doesn't focus as much on PVP, they shouldn't always get what they want if they keep doing things in irrational, chaotic, bullyish, and boorish ways that don't help progress story RP

[Irongron]

For example look to suddenly level 17 NPCs getting 100s in all stats, along with other ridiculousness.

It doesn't need to be actual combat. Mechanics aside, a party of powerful PCs isn't going to defeat an army of ten thousand, and that's not something NWN fully reflects. This was, after all, designed as a RPG not a strategic war simulator.

That's not to say I'm against wars/raids but feel it should be more akin to a series of RP/Narrative events rather than perpetual battlefields.

I blame Game of Thrones.

[Ramza]

What if the Chaotic and irrational faction actually won. How would your character live under their rule, how would daily life change. What would your character do when the madness they live by comes to your home to stay.