Cleric Necromancy

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Velkar
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Cleric Necromancy

Post by Velkar » Sun Jun 04, 2017 1:13 am

Hi,

Is it feasible to play a necromancy-based cleric? Taking the necromancy spell focuses to improve the undead summons and etc.?
If so, what domains? I was leaning towards animal, death and/or evil.

I'm not too interested in super min-maxing, I'd just like if this character was capable of levelling alone if necessary (for obvious reasons)... Would it be best to go full spellcaster or something more mixed?

Thanks for any help.

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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by DarkDreamer » Sun Jun 04, 2017 2:13 am

yes, Velsharoon comes to mind instantly.

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Dalek Caan
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Dalek Caan » Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:04 am

Necromancy is certainly a decent choice for a cleric, although for necromancer priests, I'd advise to build for a battle-cleric: Shield, Armor and weapon. Undead will be really helpful but not critical to your character. You can also be useful in groups without summoning your undead, which makes you much more flexible.

EDIT: If you want to go the caster route stick with armor and shield. For more versatility also aim for conjuration focuses and meta-magic (specifically maximize/empower spell) as buffing will be a major part of your job.

Velkar
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Velkar » Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:21 am

Dalek Caan wrote:Necromancy is certainly a decent choice for a cleric, although for necromancer priests, I'd advise to build for a battle-cleric: Shield, Armor and weapon. Undead will be really helpful but not critical to your character. You can also be useful in groups without summoning your undead, which makes you much more flexible.

EDIT: If you want to go the caster route stick with armor and shield. For more versatility also aim for conjuration focuses and meta-magic (specifically maximize/empower spell) as buffing will be a major part of your job.
Thanks! Do you know if maximize/empower spell affect the summons as well?

Nitro
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Nitro » Sun Jun 04, 2017 12:23 pm

Maximize/empower has no effect on the summons, but they will boost buff spells cast on the summon.

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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Dr_Hazard89 » Mon Jun 26, 2017 2:19 pm

Sorry to necro this necro thread (hurr), but I'm also considering a Cleric/Necromancer.

I can afford 1 metamagic feat and I'm trying to decide which would be best. I'm going back and forth between empowered and maximised. Any tips?
Characters: Xun'sali (ACTIVE), Tianae Tymeaneldth (Rolled), Sylali (Rolled), Magpie (Rolled), Ker'uanna Tymeaneldth (Rolled), Lepota Poklona (Rolled), Andariel Bloodletter (Shelved), Tahl'tril Cyredrretyn (Rolled), L'omithiel (Shelved).

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High Primate
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by High Primate » Mon Jun 26, 2017 2:51 pm

Velsharoon, Kiaransalee (if you're a drow), Set, and Orcus (Abyssal) are all good choices for a necromancer cleric.

For metamagic, I'd take extend. It works well with some of the cleric's combat buffs as well as regenerate, which will save you healing supplies and spells during longer dungeon crawls.
Last edited by High Primate on Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Some builds I've worked on (not recommended):
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Opustus
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Opustus » Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:02 pm

Buildwise, the necromancy school affords a few spiffy spells for the Clerk's disposal: Slay living, Harm, Destruction. Harm and Slay living are Touch-based spells, meaning they roll a touch attack upon cast. As a Clerk, even if you go full caster, you ought to be sporting a handsome AB, so touch spells are definitely viable. The foci should count towards the summon bonus for Clerk as well.

Refer to NWN spells here: http://nwn.wikia.com/wiki/Necromancy
To Arelith-specific spell changes here; link to summon changes in the blurb: http://wiki.arelith.com/Class_Spell_Changes

RPwise, I'd note that Necromancy school isn't restricted to evil necromancers per se. Although the summoning and creating of undead is generally considered a tabu and will attract the attention of paladins, druids and rangers, it isn't unheard of deities making exceptions to the rule. For example, Hoar allows his followers to call upon vengeful spirits as a form of servitude: it may be the priest's job to help the spirits get their revenge. Also, Kelemvor's followers, though strictly forbidden to summon undead, might often opt for Necromancy as there are many anti-undead spells in that school, most notably Undeath to Death. Death magic (Slay living, Harm etc.) is a matter of some debate, but if the wielder of that magic vows to use it honourably, it might not be banned by default. As Kelemvorites are known to handle necromancy with meticulous piety, they might be trusted to avail themselves of Necromancy in its darker forms (barring undeath, of course).

I see the Necromancy school as a vastly controversial topic for practitioners of faith and one to quickly arouse moral disputes. Despite the gruesome label of the school, scholars and clergy know better than the paint it black and white.
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susitsu
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by susitsu » Mon Jun 26, 2017 4:18 pm

Extend is a given/practically a requirement for every single spell caster, battle-clerics included :I

After extend, I usually go for scribe scroll on my clerics because GRestore is a money making machine. Divine power also sells well to monks.

I just do not feel very convinced that maximize or empower are very good choices.

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Elena
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Elena » Mon Jun 26, 2017 4:43 pm

From what I have heard, it's a bit of a destitute way of playing a Cleric Necromancer, because you get those summons sooooo late.

But, you'll get them at some point so.. :)
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Umskiptar » Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:36 pm

Elena wrote:From what I have heard, it's a bit of a destitute way of playing a Cleric Necromancer, because you get those summons sooooo late.
Isn't cleric the class that gets the undead summons the earliest when compared to the other classes?

As for necromancer cleric, I wouldn't suggest Velsharoon, he seems very wizard/sorcerer oriented to me. Don't go necro battlecleric, necro caster clerics have a lot of potential. An alternative build would be Cleric/Bard/Pale Master with undead summons and a Dracolich.

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susitsu
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by susitsu » Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:42 pm

It's because all your summons are bad until like level 24 when you get mummy dust if you bard dumped. That's why necro cleric is really unpleasant to level to 24. The same goes for arcane necros.

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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Nitro » Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:10 pm

Yeah, leveling with Necro summons is painful, just stick to elementals until you get the good vampire summons.

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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Dr_Hazard89 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 1:41 am

I keep necroing this necro thread, but I have a question.

If a cleric (pure 30) has ESF: Necro, will they be able to summon the dracolich?
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Hunter548
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Hunter548 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 1:58 am

No. Dracolich is, presently limited to Pale Masters only. However, they may add a stream book at Some Point to let non-pale masters summon the dracolich. When, who knows
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Dr_Hazard89 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 2:04 am

Hunter548 wrote:No. Dracolich is, presently limited to Pale Masters only. However, they may add a stream book at Some Point to let non-pale masters summon the dracolich. When, who knows
Thank you!
Characters: Xun'sali (ACTIVE), Tianae Tymeaneldth (Rolled), Sylali (Rolled), Magpie (Rolled), Ker'uanna Tymeaneldth (Rolled), Lepota Poklona (Rolled), Andariel Bloodletter (Shelved), Tahl'tril Cyredrretyn (Rolled), L'omithiel (Shelved).

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susitsu
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by susitsu » Sat Jul 08, 2017 2:17 am

I'm suddenly really enticed by the idea of ESF necromancy giving you access to the dracolich on your EDK.

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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Dr_Hazard89 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 2:34 am

I posted it as a suggestion. Everyone please stare at the post and think supportive thoughts.
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Astral » Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:28 pm

I played a cleric with NO necro focuses and the undead summons were pretty decent. I got 3 summons at Create Greater Undead (7th or 8th I think) and they were not joking around. They weren't broken either but they were useful in pve without any focuses at all. I'd actually recommend a cleric with no focuses to pve with the undead than the Summon Creature (morals aside).

As for the dracolich, perhaps the stream should be available for none PM necromacers with ESF necromancy but please do not make this stream the default for necromancers so neutral and good necromancers are not forced into it.
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susitsu
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by susitsu » Sun Jul 09, 2017 7:29 pm

"Good necromancers."

Hm.

No, they're not really decent, that's wrong. Old undead? Maybe, especially with cleric buffs. Current undead are terrible before epic mummy dust.

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Peppermint
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Peppermint » Wed Jul 12, 2017 3:27 am

susitsu wrote:I'm suddenly really enticed by the idea of ESF necromancy giving you access to the dracolich on your EDK.
Not going to happen.

For reasons I can't elaborate on without spoilers.

Perhaps we thought of something else?

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susitsu
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by susitsu » Wed Jul 12, 2017 3:34 am

Peppermint wrote:
susitsu wrote:I'm suddenly really enticed by the idea of ESF necromancy giving you access to the dracolich on your EDK.
Not going to happen.

For reasons I can't elaborate on without spoilers.

Perhaps we thought of something else?
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Dr_Hazard89 » Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:41 am

Peppermint wrote:
susitsu wrote:I'm suddenly really enticed by the idea of ESF necromancy giving you access to the dracolich on your EDK.
Not going to happen.

For reasons I can't elaborate on without spoilers.

Perhaps we thought of something else?
:O

Something to do with the topic of Dracoliches and Cleric Necromancers?
Characters: Xun'sali (ACTIVE), Tianae Tymeaneldth (Rolled), Sylali (Rolled), Magpie (Rolled), Ker'uanna Tymeaneldth (Rolled), Lepota Poklona (Rolled), Andariel Bloodletter (Shelved), Tahl'tril Cyredrretyn (Rolled), L'omithiel (Shelved).

Nitro
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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Nitro » Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:47 pm

I think they want to keep Dracoliches the purview of PM's, the necro specialist, but perhaps we're getting some other cookie for ESF Necromancy.

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Re: Cleric Necromancy

Post by Dr_Hazard89 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:40 am

Nitro wrote:I think they want to keep Dracoliches the purview of PM's, the necro specialist, but perhaps we're getting some other cookie for ESF Necromancy.
But isn't cleric the necromancer specialist, especially with ESF Necro? Palemaster being something to help arcane casters become more specialised?

"Necromancy is usually a poor choice for arcane spellcasters. Those who really want to master the deathless arts almost always pursue divine means. However, an alternative exists for those who desire power over undead, without losing too much of their arcane power. Enter the pale master, who draws on a font of special lore that provides a macabre power all its own." - http://nwn.wikia.com/wiki/Pale_master
Characters: Xun'sali (ACTIVE), Tianae Tymeaneldth (Rolled), Sylali (Rolled), Magpie (Rolled), Ker'uanna Tymeaneldth (Rolled), Lepota Poklona (Rolled), Andariel Bloodletter (Shelved), Tahl'tril Cyredrretyn (Rolled), L'omithiel (Shelved).

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